9 replies to this topic

[Winno]

some reviews of car audio systems finished off with a review of how the thing actually sounds.

Pick up just about any reputable home audio publication for example. In the equipment and system reviews we can read about not only the technical stuff but how the thing actually performed during a listening test.

I realise that these "reviews" are mostly subjective and I know that there are variables like room acoustics and how partnering equipment impacts on overall performance (just like a car).
It still makes for an informative read and at least, can give us a small insight into how it performed.

Too often I pick up a Hot4's, Fast Fours, NZ Performance Cars, etc and read all the juicy stuff about what's there and how it all goes together but I'm left wondering what the bloody thing sounds like!
What were it's strenghts?
What were it's weaknesses?
How did it make us feel when we put on our favourite piece of music?
The best most mags can muster so far is one or two paragraphs about some new piece of equipment that's been cut and pasted straight out of a marketing brief/brochure.
Sheesh, anyone can do that.

I'll be the first to admit that I love the technical aspect and getting that new toy installed just right but...

Isn't the sound what it's ultimately all about?

[Tha Hombre]

Fair call!

[pingpong]

but like you said, sound is a subjective topic, and your not going to be able to please everyone. What happens when joe bloggs down the street hears that the mag says its good, goes out buys a $1000 pair of speakers, then goes home and is piss disappointed with them

and is it fair in the end that if someone has spent hard $$$ and time on their car, some of these people dont want to know their shortcomings, rather they would just prefer to enjoy whats there?

but on the whole i still agree with you ...nice to know how much power, how its wired up etc, but the end of the day you still listen with your ears, and not at the specs either

[dasherhalo]

Quote

Originally posted by FuK[NuTz]2k:
but like you said, sound is a subjective topic, and your not going to be able to please everyone. What happens when joe bloggs down the street hears that the mag says its good, goes out buys a $1000 pair of speakers, then goes home and is piss disappointed with them

You can please some of the people all the time, and all of the people some of the time.......

I love subjective reveiws! IMHO, people should have the guts to publish more material of this nature: sure, you're going to get knocked by some: sh|t happens. As long as you aren't being bribed or "sponsored", and you've got something informative to pass on, share the wealth!

That's why I think Marc R should publish the amp test results. Everyone knows that the test isn't designed to be perfect: it was never set out to be so, and he stated that straight away.

Now, no-one gets to read what was promising to be an interesting article, because it might have "unfairly prejudiced" people's choices in an unfair, non-scientific method.

When I first got into car audio, i read EVERYTHING I could get my hands on: every mag that reached the stands, i had, and damn near memorised them. If you read as much as possible, and then take it all with a grain of salt, then other people's opinion can help you decide which was you want to go. Then go out and audition your shortlist. Make your own mind up!

Fuk[nutz]2K - sorry for taking a small part of your reply and blowing it out proportion: I know that isn't the only point you made: it was just a launching point for the idea I wanted to get across.

[ultim8DTM5]

This is why I love Car Audio + Electronics magazine (US publication)

Every piece of equipment is evaluated objectively by a techie who pulls the thing apart and examines the equipment on a bench, then the subjective test kicks in by another writer who tests the equipment in his own car with the same songs, EVERY TIME.

Consistancy is the best thing about it and the writing is marvellous.

[pingpong]

Quote

Originally posted by dasherhalo:

Fuk[nutz]2K  - sorry for taking a small part of your reply and blowing it out proportion: I know that isn't the only point you made: it was just a launching point for the idea I wanted to get across.

no worries....i miss all the old threads where it wasnt should i get product X or product Y or which is the best product for $X.... mental stimulation is great

it must be remembered that any magazine is first and foremost a profit centre. At the end of the day, if they dont make a profit, you dont have a magazine to read. To a certain extent as well, car audio (as we know it, not "i got fully sik subs" car audio) only represents so much to the reading public, and even to the general aftermarket auto market, and remember the australian market for anything (car audio, magazines) is a little ant in comparison to the US

So what im trying to say is the car audio enthusiast community is small, and that therefore even if they publish these reviews, and 80% of enthusiasts decide to buy it, 80% of a niche market at the end of the day isnt that much extra revenue. While some companies may take the criticism and
possibly improve it in future, other companies may withdraw advertising or future support, putting the mag in a worse financial position than it would have been originally (POSSIBLY, I have no evidence to support or contrast).

but that said on a personal level..bring the subjective reviews on

oh and on another personal level....bring back the old sq debates....... infact im going to dig one up right now

edit: my england no good ones, mine grammer i fix

[ November 08, 2003, 11:52: Message edited by: FuK[NuTz]2k ]

[Winno]

Quote

but like you said, sound is a subjective topic, and your not going to be able to please everyone. What happens when joe bloggs down the street hears that the mag says its good, goes out buys a $1000 pair of speakers, then goes home and is piss disappointed with them
 

I would say that a large percentage of posts on this site are requests for people's opinions about one brand or another and how they think others rate things.

A great review always encourages the reader to make their own decisions in the end anyway if they have the chance.

Quote

and is it fair in the end that if someone has spent hard $$$ and time on their car, some of these people dont want to know their shortcomings, rather they would just prefer to enjoy whats there?

I know that I love to get constructive, honest feedback on my set up. Afterall, that's how I got it to the point to win a National title last year. If I hadn't listened, I wouldn't be enjoying something better than what I had in the beginning. I benefited in the end. I know that some people can't take it but in the end, that's their problem. If the feedback is all positive, fantastic!

There's an Australian publication that comes out every two months or so that goes to the effort to review how things sound. They did a review a little while back of some Morel Supremo tweeters and it had some depth and meaning to have what someone thought.

I also agree that Marc should publish his review even if it is in a later issue. I think all or certainly most reviews should be conducted this way. In my opinion the only thing that should be measured "scientifically" should be the specs.
All the rest should be measuerd with the reviewers ears.

I know that there are deadlines and only a certain number of pages in each issue. This shouldn't stop a good "Contributor" providing what I suspect many of us want even if the amphasis has to change a little.

[ November 08, 2003, 18:10: Message edited by: Winno ]

[LongGone]

Car Stereo Review in the US used to run soundcheck columns in their features on cars that actually desribed the sound. The problem in Australia is that the market is very small and the magazine publishers are @hitscared of upsetting any of their advertisers by giving a bad review of their products so nearly all products get a good review. I think the other problem is that manufacturers and distributors build their demo cars to look good and sound quality is a long way down the list. It wouldn't do Pioneer any good to feature their new car in a magazine and have the journo say, "The system looks fantastic but my god, does it sound like crap!" Pioneer would be most upset, so instead they just say "My god, doesn't this install look great".

I am being too harsh?

[pingpong]

well thats exactly what i was getting at Hutch

although it wouldnt work in something like fastfours/hot4s/street machine etc, i DO think that dedicated car audio magazines should put in their actual thoughts on the sound, not just how pretty it is

[Winno]

I must say that I have not yet heard an Importers demo car sound good.

You are right in saying that they are built for show and that's fine but isn't it a shame they sound very average when they don't have to?

Maybe a luke warm review is just what they need to shake them up. Even then, a good journalist should use tact is making observations and comments.