11 replies to this topic

[Mr_Bob]

what exactly is teh difference between a standard dac and a burr brown,
i understand the difference between 1 bit and 24 bit etc, but how does burr brown differ from them?

[Cyberpunky]

Good question. I was under the impression Burr Brown was a company not a type *shrugs*. I look into it
peace
Cyberpunky

[adrianf]

yeah and they are actually part of texex instruments i think.

elite car audio

burrbrown webpage

[ December 22, 2003, 21:52: Message edited by: adrianf ]

[Mr_Bob]

fair enough, none-the-less, what makes them different from your "average" DAC?
is it just a 24bit DAC with different circuit design, or is it entirely different?

[ix]

can you hear a difference between different DAC's however?

[zoent2]

I think yes, the better the DAC the better efficiency thus create more power

the burr-brown technology been use in many high-end home audio product, recently like the award winning NAD C542 CD-Player

just my two cents

[Cyberpunky]

the main issue with the DAC process is related to jitter. Jitter is a timing issue. its a bit like trying to keep a beat with a drummer but the beat is random, and so having the 2 beats lined up isnt easy. A good DAC will be able to get timing right while an inferior DAC will have jitter and therefore impact on the sound. None of this relates to the bit rate, type or brand of DAC chip but about the circuitry surrounding the chip.

You could use a great DAC chip but if the circuitry around that chip isnt as good as possible then the resultant analogue output, will be less faithful to what was recorded.

Can you hear DACs sounding different is not an easy answer, as at best I would say, it depends. Any basic quality CD player will have an output of such high quality that hearing a diff between it and another unit is hard, to say the least. If the rest of the system is extremely high quality then you may or may not hear some differences.

When I swap from the output of my DEQ30s DAC to my apogee I cant hear any difference except for example on a particular test track where I can hear the decaying ring of a bell or triangle a second(ish) longer than with the DEQ30. On normal music or even reference tracks I cant detect which is being used. Both units of very high quality, and although the apogee proves it is superior, its such a subtle difference I wouldnt like to guess which unit was doing DAC process if I didnt know which is which.

Anyway I often hear ppl say 24 bt dacs are superior or, bit stream etc but the facts are that we are talking about such a high quality output from any digital device, that I dont think its really an issue. Im certainly happy to use DEQ for regular listening, and comps and have won several with it in action not the apogee. I dont seem to score lower with DEQ Vs Apogee, and so figure the judges of my system think it sounds fine with either DAC in use.

peace
Cyberpunky

[suparoo]

I read the part on whether you can hear the difference, and some you can some you cant, I use a TEAK CDP as my test CD for test work, and in the home sterio is a Marantz CDP and everything sounds the same, but the highs are alot clearer using the marantz..

[T-Bro]

personally in my own limited experience, i have heard the difference between cheap headunits, and expensive ones though admittedly, when it comes to comparing excellent with excellent, the differences really are tiny.

[Cyberpunky]

There is a track on the acad disc that has a triangle being struck several times. They state it is possible to hear it decay up to 20 second mark of track. Using the orion DEQ30 I can hear it till 17 second mark which isnt too shabby and the apogee I can hear it till 18 second mark.

Apart from this track I cant tell the difference, although either DAC is still a little better than what would be found in low end HU. I guess its like most things audio, in that its a case of diminshing returns, and so even a mid to high end HU will work great, and unless you are aiming at the very top end, good enough for most ppls needs
peace
Cyberpunky

[-DJ-]

a bit of trivia - a lot of purists actually prefer the 18bit burr-brown dac. i agree. i think it sounds much more musical.

it goes to show that its not the number of bits per second it can crunch, but how it crunches them!

jitter.... is the enemy. many people have tried to combat the problem... error correction... crazy transports... etc.

my sony ES cd does a good job... it actually has a digital "latch" on the digital output before and throughout the dac. this works well.

its a shame car audio manufacturers haven't gone to the same extremes really.... cos now error correction and stuff is available on comparitively "cheap" machines! hand-me-down technology....

d

[KDog]

The output of all modern audio DAC's are not discernable from each other. However they do employ different filtering techniques. This may cause a small auidble difference to be heard. I would not worry about which DAC is used and worry more about the output filter.