63 replies to this topic

[Pulse-R]

cones sound better in a car (usually) becuase the dispersion is more even.
Domes are quite directional, and harder to get 'just right'.

[Tiger]

This is the frequency graph of the 4" Philips splits. This is both tweeter and mid together obviously. I'm going to cross the XT25s at about 3kHz and the 4" can take over from there. The 4" mids can go from 3kHz down to 200Hz and I'll let the midbasses do their job from that point on.

This sound safe? Too low for these kind of midranges?

Thoughts please

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[~Spyne~]

based on THAT graph, plan sounds fine.
i'd be tempted to stop the mids at 2.5khz...the graph starts to look a little choppy after 1.5khz, possibly due to early break-up?
might also bring the hpf up around 300Hz to try and avoid any increase in distortion due to the driver reaching mech limits
best just to play around 'by ear' and see where the driver's limitations are.

p.s. i love how the output just STOPS at 20khz...obviously a very poor design, or just lazy testing (or the entire graph is marketing bs...?)

[Tiger]

Who knows... I thought that was oddballs, too :/

That sounds like a plan to try. I would cut the mid off at 2.5kHz IF I was using another tweeter. The Philips tweeters DID let the GTM series down. Too harsh. (Hence why I took them out of the equation). The XT25s peform their best from 3kHz up. We'll see how we go anyway. I'll get it all in and start from what we suggested up there^^^

Cheers dude.

[muzzy66]

Sorry, not sure if you found a mid yet!

If a 5" driver is possible, and you need a midrange you can cross low, then I would go with the SB Acoustics SB15. These drivers have outstanding midrange capabilities - response and distortion are comparable with the Revelator at about 1/5 the price, and build quality isn't far off either. Only thing that stops them from being the ultimate two-way driver is the average distortion below 160hz, and lack of extesion below 160hz. In a midrange application you could cross them at 200hz and neither of these would be a factor.

If a 5" is possible and you don't need such a low crossover, then I'd go with the Dayton RS52 dome midrange. Almost as big as the SB Acosutics 5", but it's a sealed dome unit so doesn't need an enclosure. It's limited to 500hz/600hz at the lowest on the bottom end, but from 800hz upwards it's pretty much the best pure midrange I know of. The distortion levels are so low that they practical make a mockery of the 3" / 4" / 5" cone drivers out there in terms of pure midrange. Great extension and off-axis response means you could EASILLY cross over at 3k-4k, which would make it a brilliant match for the XT25. Uber-high senitivity is always going to be big plus as well, because it saves you having to spend a gazillion dollars on amplification.

If you are limited to a 3"/ 4" driver, then I'd be checking out the Peerless HDS Exlcusive, SB Acoustics SB12 and Fountek FR88-EX...as well as the Focal 3W2 Be (if you are willing to spend THAT muich). The previous three drivers I mentioned are all nice and cheap.

Edited by muzzy66, 02 March 2010 - 09:33 PM.

[Tiger]

The RS52 is one to consider. 60WRMS @ 8ohm though... How would that work off an Alpine MRV-F407?

Now... the SD Acoustics driver you were talking about... was it the SB15NRXC30-4?

Eventually, I wouldn't mind getting a dual set of Exodus Audio Anarchy midbasses (6.5"). So I wouldn't mind either a nice 3"-4" to sit in between the Vifas and the Anarchy mids.

Fountek.. can a 4ohm version be sourced? Same as the Peerless?

[~Samuel~]

Tiger, on Mar 2 2010, 11:07 PM, said:

Eventually, I wouldn't mind getting a dual set of Exodus Audio Anarchy midbasses (6.5"). So I wouldn't mind either a nice 3"-4" to sit in between the Vifas and the Anarchy mids.

Sorry to take this a little OT but i have been waiting for someone on MEA to bring these up, im really hoping that Audiomarket Place will be bringing in some becasue they look like a great 6.5 mid bass driver

[Tiger]

Yeah, I saw the excursion vid... and I thought YUP!!! That's midbass if I've ever seen it! So between them and the XT25s..... the RS52 would make a crazy front stage, huh?

[~Samuel~]

Tiger, on Mar 2 2010, 11:17 PM, said:

Yeah, I saw the excursion vid... and I thought YUP!!! That's midbass if I've ever seen it! So between them and the XT25s..... the RS52 would make a crazy front stage, huh?

Probably close ot my idea of perfect yes

[Tiger]

Hmmm... well... RS52 just might have to do then.
I know that cones play lower, but looking at the graph on the RS52 and it speaks for itself. As Pete said... it just couples perfectly with the XT25.

[muzzy66]

Tiger, on Mar 2 2010, 11:37 PM, said:

Now... the SD Acoustics driver you were talking about... was it the SB15NRXC30-4?

Yep.

I've used them myself and while their midbass isn't out of this world, the midrange is very impressive.

They are also available in both 4ohm and 8ohm configurations I believe - not that it really makes much difference....

Quote

Fountek.. can a 4ohm version be sourced? Same as the Peerless?

Not that i'm aware of, however I microprecision do a car audio version of the Fountek driver. Here is a link (check out the 5 series): http://www.micro-precision.eu/

I'm not 100% sure if it is based on the FR88, but it does look a hell of a lot like it and I remember Luke mentioning a car audio brand that did do an FR88 clone/rebadge.

Edited by muzzy66, 03 March 2010 - 10:50 AM.

[muzzy66]

Tiger, on Mar 2 2010, 11:47 PM, said:

Yeah, I saw the excursion vid... and I thought YUP!!! That's midbass if I've ever seen it! So between them and the XT25s..... the RS52 would make a crazy front stage, huh?

Not familliar with those midbass drivers so I can't say - remember there is more to midbass then just excursion and "wow" factor. Low distortion and smooth response are important not only down low, but also up into the higher midbass and lower midrange - especially when crossing over higher to a dome midrange.

Edit: Just chcked out that driver, and I have to say it does look interesting. Q is decent enough too - should work reasonably well in a car door. Interesting...

Edited by muzzy66, 03 March 2010 - 11:08 AM.

[Luke352]

muzzy66, on Mar 3 2010, 10:48 AM, said:

I'm not 100% sure if it is based on the FR88, but it does look a hell of a lot like it and I remember Luke mentioning a car audio brand that did do an FR88 clone/rebadge.

That would be Hustler Audio http://hustleraudiou...d-Downloads.php the actually build the F88 for Fountek, the F88 is basically a budget version of there own brand drivers, the F88 uses a pure aluminium cone, whereas there drivers all use different alloy blends depending on the model to change the sonic signature or clean up cone related distortion etc...and apparently the higher models have a better motor design.

[2LOUD2OLD]

muzzy66, on Mar 3 2010, 11:48 AM, said:

Not that i'm aware of, however I microprecision do a car audio version of the Fountek driver. Here is a link (check out the 5 series): http://www.micro-precision.eu/

I'm not 100% sure if it is based on the FR88, but it does look a hell of a lot like it and I remember Luke mentioning a car audio brand that did do an FR88 clone/rebadge.

Hustler Audio are actually the company that design the Fountek
They build the Trinity which is a 3" midrange which is supposedly a better version, also available in 4ohm
http://www.haudioinc...ts/Trinity3.pdf

[muzzy66]

There we go