59 replies to this topic

[Matt VIP]

Theres a whole bunch of people who think that EQ and time alignment shouldn't be used in car audio as well. Not needed. Not necessary. "Aim" the speakers correctly and install them in just the right way and you wont need them. Makes the music "sound better" without them. All this new fangled technology is unnecessary. Then there are some who believe that a 1/3 band audiocontrol RTA with some dicky red lights, no gating for reflections and an uncalibrated mic, plus some golden ears, are all you need to make a car sound perfect.

As far as I can see, this is exactly the same thing. Do you need the MS-8 to make your car sound good? Nope, but for the rest of us, who when we tune really don't have much more than a scant idea about what we're REALLY doing to the sound and WHY we're doing it, a room correction algorithm that ACTUALLY WORKS* is going to help enormously.

Put your hand up if you use, are confident with, fully understand and implement:
An RTA with gating to account for reflections
impluse response
parametric EQ to deal with room anomalies
consistent results from ongoing measurements of speakers both in and outside the car, so you can identify which parts of your install and interior are affecting what parts of the frequency response, AND how to overcome those issues

I reckon I could count about 5 people I know. And I am not one of them.

I also think that the ability to mess with everything (t/a, eq, crossovers, gain) AFTER the auto tune has done its job is what will set the MS-8 apart.




*I have yet to see proof that the ms-8 in its current form actually works...fingers crossed though!

[br85]

I lost interest in the MS-8 when they threw away the center channel and the associated separation. Why get rid of it's most redeeming feature?

[Luke352]

I lost interest in the MS-8 when they threw away the center channel and the associated separation. Why get rid of it's most redeeming feature?

UM...it still uses a centre channel.

You can choose not to use it, it just won't be able to achieve a perfect soundstage from both seats if you don't.

[br85]

UM...it still uses a centre channel.

You can choose not to use it, it just won't be able to achieve a perfect soundstage from both seats if you don't.

Wait so it actually removes center information from the left and right channels and derives a proper center channel? That wasn't there last I heard. Serves me right for listening to secondhand information.

Is the L-R bandlimited delayed rears in here too?

If so, this unit sh!ts all over the bitone. In so many ways.

[Luke352]

Uses Lexicons Logic 7 but has been rewritten to work in car, Logic 7 is a process of creating a full 7.1 surround arrangement from a two channel mix, but you don't have to use all 8 channels if you want you can use anywhere from 1 to all 8 outputs so as far as I'm aware you can have a single channel a 2ch 2.1, 2.2, 3, 3.1, 3.2, 4, 4.1, 4.2 etc... and pretty much any other combination you can think off, there is something in the way off 50 different speaker combinations it is able to support thanks to the fact it doesn't have locked or restricted channel assignments any channel can be assigned to be any channel so you end up with no limitations on xovers, TA, or eq etc available to a particular channel which as far as I'm aware is unique, you only have to use as many channels as you wish. Same with the inputs you can either use all 8 channels for traditional input or if you have some you don't use, you can use the others as Aux inputs.

As far as Time delayed Bandlimited rears, I don't know if Logic 7 uses that process, but there is no reason why you can't set it up like that.

Edited by Luke352, 17 March 2010 - 07:57 PM.

[Gonadman2]

Oh, all of a sudden this unit is awesome. I might have to invest.

[br85]

Uses Lexicons Logic 7 but has been rewritten to work in car, Logic 7 is a process of creating a full 7.1 surround arrangement from a two channel mix, but you don't have to use all 8 channels if you want you can use anywhere from 1 to all 8 outputs so as far as I'm aware you can have a single channel a 2ch 2.1, 2.2, 3, 3.1, 3.2, 4, 4.1, 4.2 etc... and pretty much any other combination you can think off, there is something in the way off 50 different speaker combinations it is able to support thanks to the fact it doesn't have locked or restricted channel assignments any channel can be assigned to be any channel so you end up with no limitations on xovers, TA, or eq etc available to a particular channel which as far as I'm aware is unique, you only have to use as many channels as you wish. Same with the inputs you can either use all 8 channels for traditional input or if you have some you don't use, you can use the others as Aux inputs.

As far as Time delayed Bandlimited rears, I don't know if Logic 7 uses that process, but there is no reason why you can't set it up like that.

ok so 8 outputs, i assume that means you can't have 3 way LRC with sub, cos that's 10 channels. Can multiple units be used in conjunction?

[Luke352]

ok so 8 outputs, i assume that means you can't have 3 way LRC with sub, cos that's 10 channels. Can multiple units be used in conjunction?

LRC? Left Right Centre?

3 way front stage 6 channels, plus 1 for centre, plus sub thats 8, unless you are planning on a three way centre channel which seems a little crazy not to mention how the hell do you install all that in the centre of your dash.

I wouldn't bother with an extra MS-8, just grab another more basic processor or electronic xover to handle the xover and possibly TA between seperate drivers on a particular channel, probably for your 3 way centre.

Edited by Luke352, 17 March 2010 - 09:13 PM.

[br85]

LRC? Left Right Centre?

3 way front stage 6 channels, plus 1 for centre, plus sub thats 8, unless you are planning on a three way centre channel which seems a little crazy not to mention how the hell do you install all that in the centre of your dash.

I wouldn't bother with an extra MS-8, just grab another more basic processor or electronic xover to handle the xover and possibly TA between seperate drivers on a particular channel, probably for your 3 way centre.

I would probably have
Left: 3 channels
Right: 3 channels
Center: 2 channels
Rear Left: 1 channel
Rear Right: 1 channel
Sub: 1 channel

so that's 11 channels. I dare say i'd need 2 if i was to consider this unit. Not in the next 5 years though, no siree.

[tornaido_3927]

Just an update;

The price is now $799 USD which has also been confirmed by Andy

Hopefully the unit won't be AS expensive as we might be expecting..

[Damo95]

I would probably have
Left: 3 channels
Right: 3 channels
Center: 2 channels
Rear Left: 1 channel
Rear Right: 1 channel
Sub: 1 channel

so that's 11 channels. I dare say i'd need 2 if i was to consider this unit. Not in the next 5 years though, no siree.

either 2 of these or an Alpine F#1 processor..... that has 11 channels i think.. (calls shiny)

[~thematt~]

The Logic7 matrix is what makes this totally different from any other processor on the market.

This is the only one that can take 2 channels of inputs, and turn it into 7+ channels of outputs.

This is more powerful then the Bit1, even the F#1. Hell, its more appropriate for the environment then the ODR P90RS.

And its easier to use then all three.

[shiny_car]

either 2 of these or an Alpine F#1 processor..... that has 11 channels i think.. (calls shiny)

Yeah, the series 1 PXA-H900, like I and fury have, is 11 channels (incl centre).

[Luke352]

Some more info.

http://www.crunchgea...date-and-price/

Release flyer http://rs562.rapidsh...pecSheet_1_.pdf

[tornaido_3927]

Some more info.

http://www.crunchgea...date-and-price/

Release flyer http://rs562.rapidsh...pecSheet_1_.pdf

Ah you beat me to it!!

Just got home from work to inform the masses

I wonder if Andy will ever mention anything about Aus or anything international..

[SQXPRT]

I would probably have
Left: 3 channels
Right: 3 channels
Center: 2 channels
Rear Left: 1 channel
Rear Right: 1 channel
Sub: 1 channel

so that's 11 channels. I dare say i'd need 2 if i was to consider this unit. Not in the next 5 years though, no siree.

IIRC exactly what the Alpine H900 has.

Edited by Pulse-R, 19 March 2010 - 05:53 PM.

[br85]

IIRC exactly what the Alpine H900 has.

Yeah but it DOESN'T have the processing I'd need (i.e. no way I'd bother running rears if I couldn't delay them by at least 15ms, or the center channel if it can't properly derive one)

[Luke352]

Production starts March 25th.

[268669♫]

I'm just waiting for the pre order Andy is hopefully hinting at offering on DIYMA. Don't know if I'll keep it but definitely want a play.

Ant

[tornaido_3927]

If anybody is interested in the manual here's the MU link
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=WJSG663Y

Seems to be working intermittently though, maybe due to high volume..

EDIT: I finally got the manual but if anyone else can't get through, send me a PM and I'll email it to you

Edited by tornaido_3927, 22 March 2010 - 10:30 AM.

[Matt VIP]

manual is here:

http://www.divshare....ad/10837300-505

[gmcclelland]

This looks nice. I just may get one.

[Gonadman2]

Any more news on this unit? Should be in production now?

[268669♫]

Production started on the 25th march, pre orders will be shipped by 1st of june. can only pre order in the us.

Ant

[RMA]

how about auto 2 seat tuning?

oh and no noise

Bit One has four memories so you can tune it for four seats.

Bit One also has no noise when installed by a competent person.

[Captn_Awesome]

Oh this is a thread on the Bit One?

[Luke352]

Not to mention he has totally missed the point. The MS-8 is capable of making a tune that will enable both front seats to stage perfectly (if you use a centre channel) and the back seats won't be too bad either. Talking about saving a different preset which has been tuned for each seat to be used at different times is just a little off the mark.

[Luke352]

Just saw this post which shows the result of using the 31 band "EQ" (it's actually just a UI what it actually does is nothing similar to a conventional EQ). http://www.diymobile...tml#post1042546 very impressive stuff no more haircomb responses.

[268669♫]

Looks like the pre order will start shipping tomorrow, we should start hearing some user reviews soon. I wonder when they are heading to Australia.

Ant

[Big_Valven]

Unfortunately the qualifier may also be "if" they are heading to Australia.

JBL isn't pushed for the quality brand it is in Aus unfortunately.