59 replies to this topic

[268669♫]

I dont care that they are bringing it in now, after the way Convoy treat customers, i'll buy anything JBL from OS. Sometimes people shoot themselves in the foot.

Ant

[Damon]

Convoy have been like this since day one. I've had to deal with them since back in 1993, and they've always treated the car audio side of their business like a necessary evil. Sadly, there's a yawning divide between good distributors and crap ones. That JBL has been lumped with Convoy all these years and have never replaced them with a better company beggars belief, but their not the only ones.

Custom Car Sound haven't done justice to Kicker, JL Audio and MTX in years, and A-Z Trading have been equally quiet with Rockford Fosgate for a number of years too. Soundstream? I don't even know their distributor here. While Phoenix Gold have a new distributor I've not heard a peep from them either.

All these car audio brands were power houses in the '90s and I knew the people or had toured the US factories during that period. When was the last time a USA brand was well represented here....

Edited by Damon, 07 October 2010 - 05:36 PM.

[Marc ♫]

Stinger has Phoenix Gold now, but it has not launched yet Damon. I am sure enough noise will be made when the time is right.

Quote

When was the last time a USA brand was well represented here....

Orion?

[Damon]

When was the last time an engineer from any US brand come to Australia to hold seminars? These were a monthly occurrence in the '90s from the likes of Soundstream, Phoenix Gold and Rockford Fosgate, and were a great way to inspire sales staff and installers. I remember being at a seminar once when one brand connected their most powerful amplifier to a circular saw and cut their rivals amplifier in half just for laughs! That was cool!

I remember Sony's 'skunk works' engineer who was in charge of XES coming to Sydney in the late '90s when I met and interviewed him, and Cerwin Vega once brought out their chief engineer Ken Coga who proved a great conversationalist over a few beers after his very enlightening seminar. I remember going to the COnsumer Electronics Show every January and touring the major brands factories in the weeks afterward.

After 2000 there seemed to be zero effort to carry this on even though car audio sales had not yet reached their peak.

I think that after RF sold its shares publicly (coinciding with their mass market expansion into larger chains across the US), Soundstream was bought out by Power Acoustic, PPI, Orion and Polk were all absorbed by Directed, and Phoenix Gold were taken over by another company, that we witnessed a dramatic shift in their respective focus regarding engineering and marketing approaches. After this upheaval the original personalities and philosophies of each great 'brand' all but disappeared.

The only legendary US brand I consider to still truly remain independent from an engineering standpoint would be JL Audio. They're the only brand I know of that doesn't share designs with other brands in regards amplifiers, subwoofer and speaker systems. Every other brand, including Kicker and MTX, source Chinese and Korean designed and engineered products. The 'new' Soundstream Reference Series amplifiers do not share the same design as the originals, and I haven't yet seen a new product from the 'revitalized' Phoenix Gold that I can get excited about.

Its no wonder that the newer generation of kids have no recognition of these formerly hallowed brands.

[Marc ♫]

These are the times Damon - and I don't disagree with any of what you have said. Sad yes, surprising, no. It's not just our industry, but ours has been hard hit by all of the above.

Sadly, it will only get worse.

[Damon]

As I said, this all happened when car audio sales were massive.

I certainly think a lot of the original smart engineers who created these companies made a lot of money when they sold up (they were already pretty well off) and then the new owners took these hallowed names and did what they wanted with them. This is how they ended up how they are today, and I don't simply buy into that 'these are the times' in any way at all Marc.

Again I single out JL Audio as a company that proves that sticking with an engineering lead company can still achieve results.

Then there's Focal, Audison...

[Damon]

And JBL too!

[Marc ♫]

You don't have to buy into my opinion at all Damon. The fact is, it is a sign of the times indeed. This industry is no longer evolving like it once was and with the exception of OE integration, the research and development into new technology has mostly come to a stand still. It is now about selling x thousands of product a, for the maximum possible return - box moving. Manufacturer's conned on to it long before the retail chains did.

I'm not disagreeing with what you say. As the publisher of this website and playing a role within this industry it would thrill me to see training, events, international conferences and a thriving industry, of course. It will never happen again though as the industry as a whole has already peaked.

[MAS Andrew]

Damon mentions US brands that are not well represented here in Australia and were power houses in the 90's.

From our (AZ Trading's) point of view we had to change with the times, the internet being the major factor. We used to spend mountains of money on blanket advertising, car shows, demo vehicles but it all started amounting to no extra sales. Something had to give, we decided to put the extra effort into our specialist dealer network, instead of flying US reps over here, for the past 8 years or so we have taken dealers to the CES, Rockford factory to actually build amplifiers, complete RTTI specialist training and spend many hours with engineers etc. Also we have taken dealers to Germany on a few occasions to visit the German Maestro (Original MB Quart) factory where they have made their own speakers, all on display in their stores. Most of our specialist dealers talk regularly and are friends with RF and GM staff, even the Managing Directors. Because of this manufacturer involvement, AZ Trading and its specialist dealers now have a say in what is produced from tear to year.

Rockford is stronger than ever producing a full range of product and introducing many new technologies into the market, I can arrange for anyone visiting the CES in a few months to visit the Palms hotel and casino during the show to see the great new products they will have for next year. Rockford do not product share their amplifiers with anyone else, the Punch and Power range are unique in design, technologies and features. These amps have components made in many different parts of the world, factories that specialize in certain technologies, not mass producing product for 10 different companies.

As for German Maestro, 99% of their product is hand built in a small town in Germany, amazing to see this sort of place still exists.

We have a very loyal group of dealers who understand our products back to front, all customers need to do is visit them, there are 30-40 speacilists and 100 Autobarn stores that sell RF. No, it is not available at every corner store, but you can find a full range available almost anywhere in Australia and buy from someone who understands the product.

Just because a lot of people dont get regularly involved on this website doesnt mean that things arent happening.

My two bobs worth.

Andrew

Edited by Battaboom, 13 October 2010 - 01:21 PM.

[Big_Valven]

Good writeup Andrew - but I think it's also a sign that with a bit more involvement on websites such as this, companies may stand to benefit from the rapport that comes from keeping enthusiasts involved and in the loop, rather than defending things when we ask where everyone's gone. A name to the face, you know.

[Damon]

Yeah, good to hear from you Andrew. Its nice to know AZ Trading still have an ear to the ground.

Its also great to hear that dealer based programs like that still occur with AZ Trading. All of the programs I mentions from back in the '90s were dealer based.

I have to ask, though. While I know a certain logic in the car audio market says that spending all your effort on dealers is a prudent decision, what happens when the bulk of the industry does this and no one is actually promoting car audio as a past time?

Young males have so much to spend their first earnings on these days - PS3 games, iPod/Pad/Phones, internet downloading and storage, fashion, stupid girly haircuts, night clubs etc, etc. While back in the '90s they had almost none of these things gobbling up their cash. They had a pair of Levis 501s, a Rockford T-shirt, a pack of fags and their Honda Civic. That's it.

What has AZ Trading done in the past few years about promoting car audio to the market at large?

Is it not self destructive to spend all your efforts on dealers and simply wait for car audio to continue shrinking around you

There's not enough Mitsubishi OEM type business to fill the void is there?

Edited by Damon, 21 October 2010 - 06:27 AM.

[mrock]

Damon,

to answer your questions...Az products always sell...Why would you waste money on advertising if the product sells itself? Why would you want to become a modern day Sony and have your product associated with crap? Any salesman selling Rockford or GM, doesn't have to push the product much. They always sell them without a problem. Also why would you accomadate to the whipper snipper generation when they don't want to spend more than 100bucks on a sub, and buy a supercheap steering wheel instead of an original Momo? Obviously they a doing well, and as you know yourself, there isn't too much money in car audio these days. Gone are the early to mid nineties. Well, as for promoting car audio, MEASQ is doing that, and so half Lifestyle with there soundoff and a few others.

[tornaido_3927]

While you do have a point about products selling themselves, advertisement is really such an effective means of moving product though.

I think a few years ago Coke decided to stop advertising, or advertise not as much, or not advertise in certain countries or something to that effect, and it very significantly affected their sales. And I'm pretty certain Coke is the most recognisable and famous of all the soft drink brands, consumed by pretty much everybody, whilst at the same time remaining the most expensive..

They don't even change their product! Once in a while they'll bring out a new line beside the original/s though.

Granted, if they did cease to advertise, many people would still buy it, a lot. But surely there's a good reason they're still advertising the hell out of their product..?

Sorry for the huge Coke analogy, just thought it explained my point best

[Deadeye]

Just to add the perspective of someone who just joined the car audio scene about 2 or 3 years ago...

I never knew Rockford Fosgate, Focal, Mb Quartz, JL, Morel, Eclipse and Pheonix even existed until I came here or walked into a place that specialised in Car Audio...

I thought only Pioneer, Kenwood, Alpine and Sony only existed...

I guess it also comes down to if someone is serious about their car audio... they will dig beyond the mainstream super cheap or autobarn or jh hi-fi and come here to go to a specialist.. to which they will get exposed to the bigger/better brands...

Although I don't know what it was like in the 90's but I do remember going to auto Salons in the 90's thinking "who the hell at these brands?"

then again, I only got my licence in 2003 And I'm 25 years old... so again, I didn't take a huge interest in car audio until about 2005/2006

[Marc ♫]

The above post is a great example. Deadeye is a relatively new "enthusiast" and as he states, does not recognise the pioneering brands of our industry today - there is only one reason for that and we have covered it in this thread already. For brands to think they did their marketing in the 90's and now don't need to is a formula for failure. Why are brands like Option Audio, Fusion, and mainstream brands so easily identified and recognisable by the consumers and enthusiasts today? We know the answer already.

Those of us pushing mid 30's and above, particularly those working within this industry forget that the newcomer's didn't grow up or get into the industry when brands such as Rockford had the market by the horns.

Like it or not, 50,000+ enthusiasts are turning to MEA each month for information and how many more to other similar media. If you're not on here, you're missing serious exposure and brand awareness opportunities.