27 replies to this topic

[ilpala]

Im not interested in competitions or in having a system where the bass drowns out all the other speakers. I love rock music but at the same time i love house music which has a lot of bass and i want to know if im better off sticking with 12" subs or going for 10" subs which im told are better for what i want.

Also, should i get 2ohm or 4ohm subs? I read the tutorial on amps and i understand that 2ohm delivers more power than 4ohm. But is it too much power for me.. i'll be running alpine pdx amps if that helps.

I'd appreciate your opinions.

Edited by vas, 10 January 2007 - 12:07 PM.

[Shreknos]

dont follow the common misconception that 10 inch subs are tight and fast and that 15 inch subs are slow and pplay lower...


an 8 inch sub can play almost as low as an 18, in the right enclosure, and an 18 can be just as fast and tight as an 8 in the right enclosure...

so, get a sub according to how much room your willing to sacrifice to the box, and also, how much out put you want, as bigger subs are generally louder

[20Hurtz]

i personally like tens a bit better, i know there shouldn't be a real difference but they seem to blend with my front stage a bit better, i especially like tens for rock.

[ProClass]

-Charlie-, on Jan 10 2007, 12:11 PM, said:

dont follow the common misconception that 10 inch subs are tight and fast and that 15 inch subs are slow and pplay lower...
an 8 inch sub can play almost as low as an 18, in the right enclosure, and an 18 can be just as fast and tight as an 8 in the right enclosure...

so, get a sub according to how much room your willing to sacrifice to the box, and also, how much out put you want, as bigger subs are generally louder

Strictly speaking in terms of MASS larger drivers are slower and will sound more sloppy.
IMO 10's are the go.

[philz]

i would go ten, ive had 12's and jsut something about them i don't quite like them as much as 10's, and im a sucker for low loud bass, but always liked the 10s.

ermm what pdx amp is it? which one? 2chan, 4chan or mono?

If its the 2 channel/4 channel get a single 4ohm sub or a dual 2ohm sub.

If its the pdx mono- get a single 2 ohm or dual 4ohm

[kiwi]

I run 10's because I only have 5.25 fronts.. it will depend on what makes up the rest of your system. If you have 6.5's then maybe go for a 12. There seems to be a lot more options for 12's than 10's these days for some reason, probably to do with the 12 being most popular. A Dual Voice Coil sub will allow you to run in different configurations.
A single DVC (4ohm) sub could be run at 2, 4 or 8ohm in the likely event that you modify your system in the future.

[20Hurtz]

mass doesn't enter the equation. If anything mass will make it sound a bit exagerated, inductance is the one to watch for. either way the enclosure will make more of a difference the a bit of a difference in inductance or even in the dampening factor in the amp driving the sub.

[Shreknos]

Quote

in terms of MASS larger drivers are slower and will sound more sloppy.

mass is compensated for with larger voice coil, more flux in the motor...


proclass you should know better...

the only reason a 10 would be better is because the cone is smaller, meaning less area not being pushed by the former or controlled by the surround..

[20Hurtz]

no a larger voice coil will add to the mass, its hardly a compensation, a larger coil increases the power handling but lowers efficency (as it makes the mms greater).

once again, wieght may make it sound a bit sloppy (which can to an extent be controlled by altering the vas) but lag/response of the subwoofer itself is to do with the inductance funnily enough by enlarging the coil you increase the inductance.

Quote

the only reason a 10 would be better is because the cone is smaller, meaning less area not being pushed by the former or controlled by the surround..

could you explain that I didn't quite understand what you where trying to say?

[jasonakafreaky]

I think I know what Charlie is going on about;

a good example would be comparing balancing something at the end of a short stick and balancing something with a slightly longer stick.

The longer the stick, the more concentration or balance is required.

In a subwoofer's case; more control...
I reckon that is true to a certain extent, but also concur that any good sub regardless of size in a properly designed box would sound good.

[20Hurtz]

it wo'nt make any difference if your holding the middle of the stick (spider) and the top of the thing your balancing (surround) then it won't really matter how long the stick (former) is, look at the 06 re xxx absolutely massively long former/vc assembly but this is an extremely low distrortion driver! Very high SQ

[Juan Pablo Costanzo]

20Hurtz, i understand that the box will make more of a difference then small differences in Le as you posted above, but bear with me and feel free to correct any oversights/misunderstandings on my part while i indulge in some theory:

Generally, dont higher impedance voice coils have higher inductance then there lower counterparts? For example, T1 Rockfords:

T115D4 has Le of 6.0mH compared to the D2 version which has Le 4.2mH. For comparison, the T110D4 Le 4.6mH, T110D2 3.0mH. (dont know at what freq, with coils in series)

So if "sloppiness" is mostly determined by inductance, i.e the higher the inductance the longer it holds current and resists change, then shouldnt the question no longer be between 10 or 12 inch, but "i listen to dance should i get the D2 or D4 version" Because based on the above the 15D2 had lower inductance then the 10D4, which would mean that box considerations aside, the 15 would be "faster"

Edited by Joey Peeps, 10 January 2007 - 03:45 PM.

[20Hurtz]

well joey that is something! It never crossed my mind that different impediance coils would have different inductance values but i guess higher resistance coils would be smaller in gauge, as a result to achieve the same vc lenght as the lower resistance coils the higher resistance VC would have to have more turns, le is directly proportional to the number of turns in the inductor.

some one please correct me if i'm wrong

[Pulse-R]

bigger woofers usually have higher MMS too - so that would slow them down again.

Higher Le will interact more with the magnetic field, meaning higher SPL for a given input current.

[20Hurtz]

no disrespect simon but i'm gonna have to call you on both of those points. Could you perhaps explain a little more indepth, how and why?