136 replies to this topic

[SCorpion]

hey all,



i am rethinking my sub options since i've had a bit of a change of heart with my taste in music. i've been listening to a lot of classical music lately (the better the system, the more i love it) and am now questioning whether the IDMAX has sufficient presence @ 20Hz



now, pulse-r has been long raving about his peerless subs. so these may be an option, but what else is there that can play low with sufficient presence?



the sub will be paired up with a tru tech hammer in an avg sized sedan. probably cross the sub over at around 50Hz ish (the 7 inch rainbows will be crossed at 60Hz)



other than the price, i have no other restrictions. be it one sub or 18 subs, they need to have as much presence @ 20Hz as i can get, as well as being accurate and musical.



the budget is around $1k



cheers

[Alfred]

SCorpion, on Aug 25 2007, 07:17 PM, said:

hey all,



i am rethinking my sub options since i've had a bit of a change of heart with my taste in music. i've been listening to a lot of classical music lately (the better the system, the more i love it) and am now questioning whether the IDMAX has sufficient presence @ 20Hz



now, pulse-r has been long raving about his peerless subs. so these may be an option, but what else is there that can play low with sufficient presence?



the sub will be paired up with a tru tech hammer in an avg sized sedan. probably cross the sub over at around 50Hz ish (the 7 inch rainbows will be crossed at 60Hz)



other than the price, i have no other restrictions. be it one sub or 18 subs, they need to have as much presence @ 20Hz as i can get, as well as being accurate and musical.



the budget is around $1k



cheers

Have you actually heard the IDMAX's?

Tweakd (Northfield Marooka's demo car) has IDMAX10's run off TRU TECH Hammers and it would have to be the most accurate and tight subbass I have ever heard all the way down below 20Hz. The MAX12's are even more impressive with more than enough low end presence.

A

[trism]

RE XXX if you can find one....

[Luke352]

JBL W15Gti, I've got one and love it, Gary Biggs used 2 of these in his Regal and he used them up 30hz, with another 12" sub filling 30hz through to 80hz roughly I believe.

If you look at the specs page a sealed box has a 2db rise from 80hz down to 20hz and a ported box has a 10db rise from 80hz down to 30hz.

http://manuals.harman.com/JBL/CAR/Boxes%20...15GTi_rev_f.pdf

Oh that is expected in car response as they measured it obviously every car is different, but even the out of car response is impressive to say the least.

Edited by Luke352, 25 August 2007 - 10:15 PM.

[Surefire]

DLS Nobelium 12" is another option. I've got a 10" and it plays pretty low. Very accurate too.

[Pulse-R]

for good presence down to 20Hz, you'll need to get some music which goes there, and then at least 2x 15" or more woofers to move the air.

Then get about 4kW to run it with respectable headroom, and you're on the right path.

[Luke352]

Pulse R has made some very good points, what most people think is 20hz is probably closer to 40hz, and if you really want to play down to 20hz with any kind of presence (volume isn't the word because 20hz is basically getting into the inaudible range) you need to be able to move SERIOUS amounts of air, 1x12" really aint gonna cut it for real 20hz output, two 15's is where you really want to be looking or 3 or more 12's.

Some other subs worth looking at are Aurasound subs these things are by all reports amazing performers,

http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_i...;products_id=81

http://www.madisound.com/catalog/PDF/auras...NS18-992-4A.pdf

If you only want to play up to 50hz I would seriously consider the 18" these have been used with good success in a couple of IASCA/EMMA cars. They also have very low Inductance much like the JBL W Gti's which are pretty much amongst the best for Low Inductance subs.


The Peerless of course is also a great choice though to get what you want you would probably want to run at two of them with the passive radiators.

Oh and as Pulse R stated you'll need to get some music which actually goes down to 20hz and you are pretty much limited to Pipe Organ music there.

http://www.mobileelectronics.com.au/forums...showtopic=39668

Edited by Luke352, 26 August 2007 - 12:12 AM.

[Matt VIP]

mmmmmm....



organ pipe music...

[RoVer™]

Treo SSX. Plays soo damn looooowww :)

[Riley.]

the problem is, he wants lower than low

[DG Phil]

Any woofer in the right box will play down to 20Hz.

But why would you design a box to play that low at the expense of frequencies that actually occur in music!

Nothing, short of a few pipe organ notes is recorded below 30Hz. How often are you going to listen to "The Planet Krypton"?

When I was 17 I was hung up on 20Hz also, but I'm now older and wiser.

Phil

Edited by DD Phil, 26 August 2007 - 01:30 PM.

[SCorpion]

some good suggestions. i've listened to both the IDMAX and XXX's before, and the XXX was a very good sub, but also worth more than what im willing to shell out.



im really keen to hear ur experiences with the peerless woofers pulse-r. have u heard the new SGR subs? i know they must be in different price brackets, but it is my benchmark for comparing drivers to.



im yet to hear the JBL, does anybody own one that is willing to give me a listen?

[Luke352]

I'll be at the Wagga finals if your going and are in no rush, you can listen to my JBL then.

[~thematt~]

For REAL 20Hz information, you'll need a sub with the ability to play that low. Dont waste your time on units with stiff mechanical suspension and Fs above 25Hz.

Also, you'll need to move a mammoth amount of air, so you're required to get either an uber-large cone area, or ridiculous amounts of xmax. Cone area is obviously better for linear transients. Subs like the IDMAX, DLS, Treo, whilst I'm sure are great units, simply wont have the capabilities to do the job that you're after. The XXX will, but thats a serious amount of power, and you'd be stressing the Hammer too much.

The Peerless can be capable, but will require some fancy box work, and multiple units.

Personally, I think you should try the Audio Technology Flexunits 15". Only reason is because I want one, and you can let me know what they're like

Either that, or maybe the TC Sounds units. Those are some serious woofers!!

[SCorpion]

~thematt~, on Aug 26 2007, 04:17 PM, said:

For REAL 20Hz information, you'll need a sub with the ability to play that low. Dont waste your time on units with stiff mechanical suspension and Fs above 25Hz.

Also, you'll need to move a mammoth amount of air, so you're required to get either an uber-large cone area, or ridiculous amounts of xmax. Cone area is obviously better for linear transients. Subs like the IDMAX, DLS, Treo, whilst I'm sure are great units, simply wont have the capabilities to do the job that you're after. The XXX will, but thats a serious amount of power, and you'd be stressing the Hammer too much.

The Peerless can be capable, but will require some fancy box work, and multiple units.

Personally, I think you should try the Audio Technology Flexunits 15". Only reason is because I want one, and you can let me know what they're like

Either that, or maybe the TC Sounds units. Those are some serious woofers!!

ill have to snoop around and see if i can find any reviews on some of these subs, to get a bit of a feel for them.



whats the peerless ones worth anyway? the XXLS is the type im after i guess. multiple drivers doesn't worry me to much, so long as the hammer can handle it of course