I am getting a whole new system for my new car and I am unsure on which subs to get. I all ready have 2 of the old style Kicker 12" Solo Baric L7's and want to upgrade from these.
I was looking at either 2 x 12" JBL gti subs or
2 x Soundstream Trantula 12"
or 2 x JL w6v2 12"
I want the bass to be clear but at the same time loud and deep. Or if any one else out there has any other reccomndations please I would like to hear them.
Full Version: Best and loudest SQ subs for my new system
I'd get a Brahma, IDMAX, or a DD 3512.
These woofers are such high quality that even the 15inch versions are heaps tight.
If you want big Deep bass go with a single 15's u wont be disappointed.
These woofers are such high quality that even the 15inch versions are heaps tight.
If you want big Deep bass go with a single 15's u wont be disappointed.
IDMAX gets my vote
VERY nice subs
VERY nice subs
I'd go a single DD 9515, so much clean tight bass it will scare you.
We put a single 9515 into AJs Predule, it hit so hard and fast people swore it was six 10s! Plus it hit 149dB at 42Hz!
Phil
[ August 19, 2003, 22:18: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
We put a single 9515 into AJs Predule, it hit so hard and fast people swore it was six 10s! Plus it hit 149dB at 42Hz!
Phil
[ August 19, 2003, 22:18: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
To get as loud as possible without distortion (and assuming you have enough power) you need as much linear displacement as possible.
While it is possible to get loud with a limited amount of linear displacement, bandwith will of course suffer. (ie in SPL installs - they peak at a specific frequency)
Low bass will also suffer, as when you go down an octave the speaker cone has to move four times as much to maintain the same SPL. (assuming no other variables, like vented enclosures, or cabin gain etc etc)
Now linear displacement is simply cone area multiplied by linear xmax.
At this point I have to define linear xmax as this is often misunderstood. Linear xmax is not how far the coil can move. I could design you a sub that has 0mm of linear xmax, yet the coil may be able move 100mm while there is still some coil remaining in the gap. Linear xmax is simply how far the coil can move before the specs change significantly and it puts out an audible amount of distortion. A general rule of thumb is as soon as the BL (motor strength), Cms (suspension compliance) or Le deviates by more than 25-30% then the excursion will no longer be linear and therefore distortion will result..
Currently the Adire Audio Tumult has the largest linear excursion on the market (is available in Australia) -
http://www.adireaudio.com/diy_audio/driver...dire/tumult.htm
While it is possible to get loud with a limited amount of linear displacement, bandwith will of course suffer. (ie in SPL installs - they peak at a specific frequency)
Low bass will also suffer, as when you go down an octave the speaker cone has to move four times as much to maintain the same SPL. (assuming no other variables, like vented enclosures, or cabin gain etc etc)
Now linear displacement is simply cone area multiplied by linear xmax.
At this point I have to define linear xmax as this is often misunderstood. Linear xmax is not how far the coil can move. I could design you a sub that has 0mm of linear xmax, yet the coil may be able move 100mm while there is still some coil remaining in the gap. Linear xmax is simply how far the coil can move before the specs change significantly and it puts out an audible amount of distortion. A general rule of thumb is as soon as the BL (motor strength), Cms (suspension compliance) or Le deviates by more than 25-30% then the excursion will no longer be linear and therefore distortion will result..
Currently the Adire Audio Tumult has the largest linear excursion on the market (is available in Australia) -
http://www.adireaudio.com/diy_audio/driver...dire/tumult.htm
I have never heard the DD subs and I don't know anyone with one. Does anyone know how much the Tumult retails for over here. I have used Adire's Shiva driver and it did not impress me that much so I'm kind of hesitant to fork out over $1200 (at least) on a driver I can not hear or see until after I buy it.
I Will be getting my new system professionally installed into my new car (Mazda 6) I have not bought any of the componets yet but what I amlooking at is:
Head unit : Alpine 9815
Front Splits: Dynaudio Sys 240 or Sys 360
and Alpine amps to power them
The MRD-M1000 for subs
and Mrv-T420 for splits
If any one can suggest anything better than what I am looking at please do. My budget is $6000 including the install, If you suggest a system the only thing is that I want to buy all the componets from the same store and have them do a custom install into the car.
[ August 20, 2003, 07:26: Message edited by: Court Jester ]
I Will be getting my new system professionally installed into my new car (Mazda 6) I have not bought any of the componets yet but what I amlooking at is:
Head unit : Alpine 9815
Front Splits: Dynaudio Sys 240 or Sys 360
and Alpine amps to power them
The MRD-M1000 for subs
and Mrv-T420 for splits
If any one can suggest anything better than what I am looking at please do. My budget is $6000 including the install, If you suggest a system the only thing is that I want to buy all the componets from the same store and have them do a custom install into the car.
[ August 20, 2003, 07:26: Message edited by: Court Jester ]
with that kinda power, I think you're better off with and idmax... the brahmas and tumults will need more power to reach max potential
That may be so but I can buy 2 amps or a more powerfull single amp. The alpine amps are under rated their birth certificate is often over 1300w.
Has anyone heard the Sound Stream Davinchi drivers. Are they a SQ or SPL sub. And anyone know the RRP on them.
And does anyone know weather any of the drivers in this class would be better than my current solo baric L7's.
[ August 20, 2003, 08:04: Message edited by: Court Jester ]
Has anyone heard the Sound Stream Davinchi drivers. Are they a SQ or SPL sub. And anyone know the RRP on them.
And does anyone know weather any of the drivers in this class would be better than my current solo baric L7's.
[ August 20, 2003, 08:04: Message edited by: Court Jester ]
Court Jester,
Have a squiz at this review by Tom Noisaine,
http://www.m-emag.com/article.asp?section_...mber=3&preview=
Have a squiz at this review by Tom Noisaine,
http://www.m-emag.com/article.asp?section_...mber=3&preview=
are you going to sell your L7's?
I might be interested in 1 if it's witihin my budget/
I might be interested in 1 if it's witihin my budget/
In Order for preferance:
SI Magnum D2 12"
JL Audio 13w7
Elemental Designs e12A
IDMAX 12"
DD 3512
Adire Audio Brahma 12"
Ps. I like 12"
SI Magnum D2 12"
JL Audio 13w7
Elemental Designs e12A
IDMAX 12"
DD 3512
Adire Audio Brahma 12"
Ps. I like 12"
Got a link to SI Magnum D2 12" subs or some information about them
As far as my L7's go I am not too sure what I am going to do with them yet.
As far as my L7's go I am not too sure what I am going to do with them yet.
I not so long ago got my IDMAX12in a temporary 1.5cuft sealed box running off my Lrx 1.400 getting 900W.
Very happy with the results so far, dynamics are great and I can't fault the ouput from the limited testing ive done on my system so far. I did maybe expect it to be a touch louder than what it is but my car has a huge cabin space (VR Caprice) however it's easily loud enough for my mainly SQ purposes. Been playing with WinISD and tempted to try a ~2.5cuft ported to ~25hz from memory which gives just as smoother response with a few more DB. I'll let you know if I ever get around to that.
Great sub though and highly recommend it
Cheers
Andy
Very happy with the results so far, dynamics are great and I can't fault the ouput from the limited testing ive done on my system so far. I did maybe expect it to be a touch louder than what it is but my car has a huge cabin space (VR Caprice) however it's easily loud enough for my mainly SQ purposes. Been playing with WinISD and tempted to try a ~2.5cuft ported to ~25hz from memory which gives just as smoother response with a few more DB. I'll let you know if I ever get around to that.
Great sub though and highly recommend it
Cheers
Andy
I'd go with a DD 9515, it eats all the abovementioned subs live. It will take 2500W all day, and has over 2 inches of real world excursion.
Forget the Dumax specs you've seen on Brahmas etc, it's easy to machine the top plate to have two small gaps and generate big Dumax numbers, in the real world it adds up to a weak motor.
We put a single 9515 in AJs Prelude; it hits 149dB at 40Hz and sounds like nothing you've ever heard before. It hits so hard and fast people swear it's got six 10s!
Email or call me and I'll tee up an audition for you.
You're on the right track with the Dyns, also look at the Boston PRO 3 way it's easier to install in your car. If you want in your face loud the Bostons are the speakers for you.
Personally I'd go with the new Boston amps, the GT28 it rated at 1250Wrms at 2 ohms, it sounds like no D class ever could. I've never heard subs sound as good as off a GT28. A bargain at $1399
Phil
[ August 22, 2003, 07:41: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
Forget the Dumax specs you've seen on Brahmas etc, it's easy to machine the top plate to have two small gaps and generate big Dumax numbers, in the real world it adds up to a weak motor.
We put a single 9515 in AJs Prelude; it hits 149dB at 40Hz and sounds like nothing you've ever heard before. It hits so hard and fast people swear it's got six 10s!
Email or call me and I'll tee up an audition for you.
You're on the right track with the Dyns, also look at the Boston PRO 3 way it's easier to install in your car. If you want in your face loud the Bostons are the speakers for you.
Personally I'd go with the new Boston amps, the GT28 it rated at 1250Wrms at 2 ohms, it sounds like no D class ever could. I've never heard subs sound as good as off a GT28. A bargain at $1399
Phil
[ August 22, 2003, 07:41: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
umm... the dd9515 is mechanically limited at around 20mm... what do u mean it can do over 2" in real world use?
http://www.adireaudio.com/Files/DUMAX/DD9515b.pdf
http://www.adireaudio.com/Files/DUMAX/DD9515b.pdf
Resonant Engineering makes the subs for Adire, for Beyond Audio, Better Audio etc.
Ask the JBL professional guys what they think of dumax, or any real speaker manufacturer. Nobody of consequence will use it. It makes no sense to
drive a speaker cone with air pressure to measure electrical changes. Weak motors like the adire can be made to score a big dumax number, but the motor can't stop and start a coil under real power, neither can the weak suspension.
It's easy to machine the top plate to make two gaps and give big numbers on the DUMAX like in a Brahma. In the real world it doesn't stack up.
Further, it's easy to prep a single woofer for a test and then quote those numbers for ever more. If you still value DUMAX here's a real BRAHMA test.
DD woofers are made by DD, not for DD like these other brands.
Phil
[ August 24, 2003, 12:30: Message edited by: Bodyjar ]
Ask the JBL professional guys what they think of dumax, or any real speaker manufacturer. Nobody of consequence will use it. It makes no sense to
drive a speaker cone with air pressure to measure electrical changes. Weak motors like the adire can be made to score a big dumax number, but the motor can't stop and start a coil under real power, neither can the weak suspension.
It's easy to machine the top plate to make two gaps and give big numbers on the DUMAX like in a Brahma. In the real world it doesn't stack up.
Further, it's easy to prep a single woofer for a test and then quote those numbers for ever more. If you still value DUMAX here's a real BRAHMA test.
DD woofers are made by DD, not for DD like these other brands.
Phil
[ August 24, 2003, 12:30: Message edited by: Bodyjar ]
QUOTE
posted by - dingaling
umm... the dd9515 is mechanically limited at around 20mm... what do u mean it can do over 2" in real world use?
the 9515 we hooked up to the power point moved a good 10cm peak to peak before the spider ripped of umm... the dd9515 is mechanically limited at around 20mm... what do u mean it can do over 2" in real world use?
[ August 23, 2003, 19:31: Message edited by: tuneman ]
Phil, it seems you have missed the point.
When designing a Sound Quality system, you want to minimize distortion right?
Well as I said, you could have a driver that has 100" of "real world" excursion, but yet, there could be distortion!
The whole point of dumax is to measure the BL and cms curves, so you can see how far the coil can move BEFORE DISTORTION IS SIGNIFICANT. It does NOT tell you how far the coil can move - a sub can dumax at 0 mm and yet still have 200mm of electrical excursion - but in the real world it will be producing significant distortion while its at it!
My point is, the dumax derived xmax figures may not be useful for determining the amount of excursion for SPL, but as far as SQ is concerned they are important!
As far as your BL comment goes, AA has stated many times that xbl2 does not reduce BL.
They chose those values of BL for the Brahma and Tumult specifically to give them a particular efficiency bandwith value.
More/less BL does not mean a driver will have better/worse SQ, it only means the driver will have a higher efficiency for a given amount of moving mass. But as you may know, The higher the BL, the less the bandwidth - a speaker that has a (relatively) very high BL might be very good as a midbass driver, or for SPL but it will lack efficiency (and require equilization) at low sub bass frequencys.
Now I'm not stating that DD 9515s are "midbass wonders" or that they produce significant distortion etc.
Quite the opposite. (although the specs on DDs site will lead you to belive that it is a midbass wonder, but who says those specs are correct). 9515s may still have enough linear excursion that they can handle their rated power (1200w.rms) without significant distortion.
As for your other post, while you have posted a lot of incorrect information (including that incorrect dumax report, which could be considered as slanderous..) I do not wish to comment just yet.
[ August 23, 2003, 20:10: Message edited by: Bassaholic ]
When designing a Sound Quality system, you want to minimize distortion right?
Well as I said, you could have a driver that has 100" of "real world" excursion, but yet, there could be distortion!
The whole point of dumax is to measure the BL and cms curves, so you can see how far the coil can move BEFORE DISTORTION IS SIGNIFICANT. It does NOT tell you how far the coil can move - a sub can dumax at 0 mm and yet still have 200mm of electrical excursion - but in the real world it will be producing significant distortion while its at it!
My point is, the dumax derived xmax figures may not be useful for determining the amount of excursion for SPL, but as far as SQ is concerned they are important!
As far as your BL comment goes, AA has stated many times that xbl2 does not reduce BL.
They chose those values of BL for the Brahma and Tumult specifically to give them a particular efficiency bandwith value.
More/less BL does not mean a driver will have better/worse SQ, it only means the driver will have a higher efficiency for a given amount of moving mass. But as you may know, The higher the BL, the less the bandwidth - a speaker that has a (relatively) very high BL might be very good as a midbass driver, or for SPL but it will lack efficiency (and require equilization) at low sub bass frequencys.
Now I'm not stating that DD 9515s are "midbass wonders" or that they produce significant distortion etc.
Quite the opposite. (although the specs on DDs site will lead you to belive that it is a midbass wonder, but who says those specs are correct). 9515s may still have enough linear excursion that they can handle their rated power (1200w.rms) without significant distortion.
As for your other post, while you have posted a lot of incorrect information (including that incorrect dumax report, which could be considered as slanderous..) I do not wish to comment just yet.
[ August 23, 2003, 20:10: Message edited by: Bassaholic ]
Ah very true about the "midbass woofer" comment. I thought this when looking at the specs also.
My opinion: Most people think "tight bass" is the higher end bass, a speaker that is more of a "midbass woofer" will appear to be tighter, but down low and at high power it wont have as much control over the cone as say the Tamult.
On OCAU i actually said the Tamult was the best sub in the world, its pretty damn impressive i must say. If i won powerball i would be getting two Tamults to go in my boot
Two DD 9515's would go just as nice though, would be a tad louder too.
My opinion: Most people think "tight bass" is the higher end bass, a speaker that is more of a "midbass woofer" will appear to be tighter, but down low and at high power it wont have as much control over the cone as say the Tamult.
On OCAU i actually said the Tamult was the best sub in the world, its pretty damn impressive i must say. If i won powerball i would be getting two Tamults to go in my boot
Two DD 9515's would go just as nice though, would be a tad louder too.
Bassholic, you're missing the point.
The point was that DUMAX numbers aren't worth sh*t.
The Brahma has good DUMAX numbers in spite of the weak motor.
I brought this up after someone mentioned DUMAX numbers earlier.
Phil
[ August 23, 2003, 20:20: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
The point was that DUMAX numbers aren't worth sh*t.
The Brahma has good DUMAX numbers in spite of the weak motor.
I brought this up after someone mentioned DUMAX numbers earlier.
Phil
[ August 23, 2003, 20:20: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
Argument over guys, the guy who posted this has got subs already, no more needs to be said...
Argument over guys, the guy who posted this has got subs already, no more needs to be said...
Echo echo
I think you meant destijil engineering who make adire etc.
They use the same common parts (as do LOTS of companys even your beloved DD, strange but true)
Also DD outsouce for parts
Somethings seem to go in one ear and out the other with some people...
**********ATTN PHIL***********
Those dumax figure you posted are not reliable.
A error occured with the dumax machine and as such it has been published(By dumax themself) that they are not to be used.
So please remove them or they will be removed for you. As it has been mentioned they are not to be posted or refered to.
[ August 23, 2003, 20:47: Message edited by: KraSE ]
QUOTE
Resonant Engineering makes the subs for Adire, for Beyond Audio, Better Audio etc.
Phil Inhumans are made in Canada by Don.I think you meant destijil engineering who make adire etc.
They use the same common parts (as do LOTS of companys even your beloved DD, strange but true)
QUOTE
The point was that DUMAX numbers aren't worth sh*t.
Dumax means something, if you can understand how to interpret the dataQUOTE
DD woofers are made by DD, not for DD like these other brands.
I really don't care who makes my woofer, just how if performs, I don't hold any prejudices on brands who outsouce to make products. I call it smart business sence if it isn't worth there while to make there own or haven't got the expeience in manufacturing woofer when there are plenty of companys that do, can make themAlso DD outsouce for parts
Somethings seem to go in one ear and out the other with some people...
**********ATTN PHIL***********
Those dumax figure you posted are not reliable.
A error occured with the dumax machine and as such it has been published(By dumax themself) that they are not to be used.
So please remove them or they will be removed for you. As it has been mentioned they are not to be posted or refered to.
[ August 23, 2003, 20:47: Message edited by: KraSE ]
Why should I remove someone just because you don't agree with it?
Phil
Phil
Because it is not accurate!?!
Who says it's not accurate?
Tell you what, lets get hold of Brahma and I'll offer up a 9500
We'll run each with a 1kW 50Hz tone and see which gives up first.
If one doesn't win in the fist half hour we'll keep uping the power in 500W intervals until one does.
I'll use a customer's 6000W Crown pro amp, it won't quit! (He runs 2 9515 in his home cinema at 3000Wrms each).
Phil
[ August 24, 2003, 14:31: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
Tell you what, lets get hold of Brahma and I'll offer up a 9500
We'll run each with a 1kW 50Hz tone and see which gives up first.
If one doesn't win in the fist half hour we'll keep uping the power in 500W intervals until one does.
I'll use a customer's 6000W Crown pro amp, it won't quit! (He runs 2 9515 in his home cinema at 3000Wrms each).
Phil
[ August 24, 2003, 14:31: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
Wasn't the topic, "best and loudest SQ subs"?
I hardly think handling high power test tones has much to do with sound quality.
========================================
Anyway, I'm not sure why Phil hasn't already said this, but that 9515 report is for the old "b" model, they are up to the "e" model now, not to mention DD sells quite a few different coil models with not-so-subtle coil height differences so the numbers will vary quite a bit..
I hardly think handling high power test tones has much to do with sound quality.
========================================
Anyway, I'm not sure why Phil hasn't already said this, but that 9515 report is for the old "b" model, they are up to the "e" model now, not to mention DD sells quite a few different coil models with not-so-subtle coil height differences so the numbers will vary quite a bit..
QUOTE
Originally posted by Incar Phil:
It's easy to machine the top plate to make two gaps and give big numbers on the DUMAX like in a Brahma. In the real world it doesn't stack up.
Further, it's easy to prep a single woofer for a test and then quote those numbers for ever more. If you still value DUMAX here's a real BRAHMA test.
DD woofers are made by DD, not for DD like these other brands.
Phil
Can you explain what "doesn't stack up" means? Doesn't stack up in sq? low distortion? strong lowend response in a box <1 cubic feet?It's easy to machine the top plate to make two gaps and give big numbers on the DUMAX like in a Brahma. In the real world it doesn't stack up.
Further, it's easy to prep a single woofer for a test and then quote those numbers for ever more. If you still value DUMAX here's a real BRAHMA test.
DD woofers are made by DD, not for DD like these other brands.
Phil
if dumax test aren't good, then what is another good standard test to compare drivers with?
Sure DD's are made by DD for DD, does that automatically mean it'll sound good? and automatically come with 2" peak to peak excursion?
Sure they get loud, what are the distortion levels like?
QUOTE
Originally posted by Bassaholic:
Wasn't the topic, "best and loudest SQ subs"?
I hardly think handling high power test tones has much to do with sound quality.
========================================
Anyway, I'm not sure why Phil hasn't already said this, but that 9515 report is for the old "b" model, they are up to the "e" model now, not to mention DD sells quite a few different coil models with not-so-subtle coil height differences so the numbers will vary quite a bit..
1. DUMAX numbers are meaningless.Wasn't the topic, "best and loudest SQ subs"?
I hardly think handling high power test tones has much to do with sound quality.
========================================
Anyway, I'm not sure why Phil hasn't already said this, but that 9515 report is for the old "b" model, they are up to the "e" model now, not to mention DD sells quite a few different coil models with not-so-subtle coil height differences so the numbers will vary quite a bit..
2. The topic is "Best and Loudest SQ subs for my new system"
DD woofers are built by a company whose background is in PRO audio, making the best sounding speakers for recording studios, cinemas and concert halls. DDs are SQ woofers that just happen to be the worlds loudest, thanks to their incredible build quality and efficiency.
I don't know of a sub that can match a DD's abilities.
As for the relevance of a massive power test, I'm sure it will prove or disprove any of the Xmax or power handling claims made by either manufacturer.
As the saying goes, put your money where your mouth is. I have.
Phil
[ August 24, 2003, 22:07: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
how are dumax #'s meaningless?
It's totally objective, no bias at all. It measures linear excursion, mechanical excursion, and motor strength. A machine can't show favoritism.
It's totally objective, no bias at all. It measures linear excursion, mechanical excursion, and motor strength. A machine can't show favoritism.
[quote]Originally posted by Incar Phil:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bassaholic:
[qb]DD woofers are built by a company whose background is in PRO audio, making the best sounding speakers for recording studios, cinemas and concert halls. DDs are SQ woofers that just happen to be the worlds loudest, thanks to their incredible build quality and efficiency.
I don't know of a sub that can match a DD's abilities. [/quote]I think plenty could match DD
Worlds loudest... in what, the worlds loudest is a guy with 108 6.5" mid bass woofers in his car IIRC. oh you mean db Drag, a full extreme car really shows a woofers SQ ability
Also DUMAX does mean somthing. Just like any specs on a woofer. interperate them how u like, just because you don't make sense of what it does doesn't make it worthless, maybe to you...
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bassaholic:
[qb]DD woofers are built by a company whose background is in PRO audio, making the best sounding speakers for recording studios, cinemas and concert halls. DDs are SQ woofers that just happen to be the worlds loudest, thanks to their incredible build quality and efficiency.
I don't know of a sub that can match a DD's abilities. [/quote]I think plenty could match DD
Worlds loudest... in what, the worlds loudest is a guy with 108 6.5" mid bass woofers in his car IIRC. oh you mean db Drag, a full extreme car really shows a woofers SQ ability
Also DUMAX does mean somthing. Just like any specs on a woofer. interperate them how u like, just because you don't make sense of what it does doesn't make it worthless, maybe to you...
QUOTE
Originally posted by Bassaholic:
Wasn't the topic, "best and loudest SQ subs"?
I hardly think handling high power test tones has much to do with sound quality.
========================================
Anyway, I'm not sure why Phil hasn't already said this, but that 9515 report is for the old "b" model, they are up to the "e" model now, not to mention DD sells quite a few different coil models with not-so-subtle coil height differences so the numbers will vary quite a bit..
Like this You mean Wasn't the topic, "best and loudest SQ subs"?
I hardly think handling high power test tones has much to do with sound quality.
========================================
Anyway, I'm not sure why Phil hasn't already said this, but that 9515 report is for the old "b" model, they are up to the "e" model now, not to mention DD sells quite a few different coil models with not-so-subtle coil height differences so the numbers will vary quite a bit..
DUMAX doesn't generate the same forces as a speaker does when under power, that's why it's a flawed measurement system.
Do some research before you come on and bag every thing I say.
Phil
Do some research before you come on and bag every thing I say.
Phil
QUOTE
Originally posted by Incar Phil:
DUMAX doesn't generate the same forces as a speaker does when under power, that's why it's a flawed measurement system.
Do some research before you come on and bag every thing I say.
Phil
in regards to excursion, it doesn't matter if it force moving the driver is electrical or something else... it still has its excursion limits set by its suspension, basket, surround, or whatever... I don't think you can argue that point.
DUMAX doesn't generate the same forces as a speaker does when under power, that's why it's a flawed measurement system.
Do some research before you come on and bag every thing I say.
Phil
RE XXX
QUOTE
Originally posted by Incar Phil:
DUMAX doesn't generate the same forces as a speaker does when under power, that's why it's a flawed measurement system.
Huh???DUMAX doesn't generate the same forces as a speaker does when under power, that's why it's a flawed measurement system.
Please Explain.
QUOTE
Originally posted by RetroPimp:
RE XXX
Know of any Australian retailers? RE XXX
Thats why I didn't mention it anyway.
Moving a cone to full excursion by applying air pressure to it is one thing.
Moving a cone to full excursion at 30km/hr, then stopping it virtually instantaneously and moving back in the opposite direction at 30km/hr, 80 times a second is another.
It takes a massive motor to do this and control the cone motion accurately. DUMAX tests do not reflect this, hence they are BOGUS.
In DUMAX an outside force moves the cone, not the motor.
Please think about this for a moment before you respond!
Phil
Moving a cone to full excursion at 30km/hr, then stopping it virtually instantaneously and moving back in the opposite direction at 30km/hr, 80 times a second is another.
It takes a massive motor to do this and control the cone motion accurately. DUMAX tests do not reflect this, hence they are BOGUS.
In DUMAX an outside force moves the cone, not the motor.
Please think about this for a moment before you respond!
Phil
You don't actually believe that the higher the BL, the better the SQ, or do you?
[ August 27, 2003, 00:42: Message edited by: Bassaholic ]
[ August 27, 2003, 00:42: Message edited by: Bassaholic ]
dumax was never intended to be used as a measure of 'sq' of a sub. Its purpose was to give you measurements... objective measurements.
Oh my god!
Did you even read my last post?
Phil
[ August 27, 2003, 08:25: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
Did you even read my last post?
Phil
[ August 27, 2003, 08:25: Message edited by: Incar Phil ]
people can regurgitate sales hype all they like.
i've GOT a brahma.
i love it, it's by FAR the best sub i've ever heard,
i'm yet to hear a sub that'll take 2000WRMS, with no audible distortion until the coil hits the backplate. which i can only do when playing music which has program under 25Hz.
i recon I've heard just about every sub worth listening to (that's distributed in Oz)
including 9515's,
9515's don't have much linear excursion, it's also a really ugly look to see the cones flex
no doubt they are good for SPL though.
i've GOT a brahma.
i love it, it's by FAR the best sub i've ever heard,
i'm yet to hear a sub that'll take 2000WRMS, with no audible distortion until the coil hits the backplate. which i can only do when playing music which has program under 25Hz.
i recon I've heard just about every sub worth listening to (that's distributed in Oz)
including 9515's,
9515's don't have much linear excursion, it's also a really ugly look to see the cones flex
no doubt they are good for SPL though.
QUOTE
Originally posted by Bassaholic:
Know of any Australian retailers? quote:
Originally posted by RetroPimp:
RE XXX
Thats why I didn't mention it anyway. [/QB]
none as yet, but hopefuly soon
oh and phill whats the difference between 100kg of steel and a 100kg of feathers???
thats what u are trying to do here??
you telling me the motor structure ona sub can generate more force on a sub that a specialy designrd machine???
bah
QUOTE
Originally posted by Incar Phil:
Oh my god!
Did you even read my last post?
Phil
I don't think it's that people dont read what you say Phil. I think it's that EVERYTIME someone wants to buy a sub DD gets a mention, and if someone wants to buy speakers then hertz gets the call and if someone wants an amp the Audison are there. Oh my god!
Did you even read my last post?
Phil
IMO Poeple are just getting tired of hearing about these products. They are all good, they compete in the same market as Alpine, Rockford, Orion, PPI, Lightning Audio, Focal, Dyn, PG etc and to be frank, if their as good as the distributers are saying then free plugs in every thread shouldn't be needed.
/end rant
Mick
end of story' we hope!!
mick007: audison and Hertz come from a different Phil.
hahahahaha
QUOTE
Originally posted by Mr_Bob:
mick007: audison and Hertz come from a different Phil.
Sorry mate, I know that, I was 'ranting' and didn't specify which fella. But my opinion stands for both 'Phils'. With audio, if it sounds good...buy it but the repeditive DD, Audison, Hertz brand hype on this site is getting pretty anoying. I read most posts, and I am on this site 3-4 times a day at work and don't post much, but I'm sick of seeing a new person in car audio get 'steered' into a direction when there are so many other brands out their. mick007: audison and Hertz come from a different Phil.
Cheers
Mick
QUOTE
Originally posted by mick007:
Sorry mate, I know that, I was 'ranting' and didn't specify which fella. But my opinion stands for both 'Phils'. With audio, if it sounds good...buy it but the repeditive DD, Audison, Hertz brand hype on this site is getting pretty anoying. I read most posts, and I am on this site 3-4 times a day at work and don't post much, but I'm sick of seeing a new person in car audio get 'steered' into a direction when there are so many other brands out their. quote:
Originally posted by Mr_Bob:
[b]mick007: audison and Hertz come from a different Phil.
Cheers
Mick
[/b]
good idea that closing of this thread!!
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