Hi again! Yes it's me asking more questions about an SQ set up (again)

Now that I have just about secured 3 out of 4 components, I am left with a choice of subwoofers. It is limited to 10" or 11" because I am fitting it into the boot of an S15 200SX and I need the rest of my boot for storage. A custom box will be made with no expense spared to ensure a good fit as well as ZERO compromise in quality. However, I still have to choose the sub.

Recap: Eclipse 8443 deck, Focal Polyglass 165V3E (3 way splits), Phoenix Gold Ti 500.4 (most likely), Subwoofer???

Candidates:
Infinity Kappa Perfect 10.1 (10 inch SVC)
Eclipse Aluminium SW8102 (10 inch, SVC)
Focal K2 Power 27KX (11 inch SVC)

Any other suggestion? Phoenix Gold Ti?

Please inform me of what YOU would choose for yourself in my situation and why. Thanks heaps!

Xtant X104 or X1044, Boston Pro 10.5LF

they r my personal favourites

hi.. Im just wondering where can you get infinity kappa perfect from in Australia? And how much? i might be interested...

Infinity Perfect subs can be bought at HiFi Supermarket in Victoria, not sure about NSW though.

How much power do you have? Or will you choose the sub first, then buy an amp to suit it?

I'd say Brahma, JL W7, Xtant, Boston and more...

Well i would have to DEFINITELY choose IMAGE DYNAMICS - IDMAX. Actually i already have one
It is an awesome sub, you won't be dissappointed. Other subs that i would choose is a W7 and Adire Audio Brahma.

Phat Devil

Ive heard the JL W7 running on a friend's car.. and Im not too happi with it =( i dont know why... its just too much bass for me.. But xtant is ok!! you guys know what sort of sub doesnt give as much bass as the W7... somewhere around the xtant? And the prices as well if you guys know... Thanks

I haven't heard the xtant, but couldn't you just turn the sub down?

The IDMAX rrp is only 850 or so.
You can probably get it cheaper tho.

The PG Ti is a bee-ute-iful sub, I have 2 12s, just great things.

The Boston Pro 10.5 and Infinity you mentioned also excellent.
The Image Dynamics is also a class act but don't forget the IDQ10v2, quite a bit cheaper than an IDMAX but doesn't go as hard. SQ is nice tho'.
You need real power to get the Xmax of an IDMAX....

JL 10W3v2 would also be on the list. Not to be under-estimated well set up.

For looks, the PG, Infinity and xtant imo, the others are fairly plain looking by comparison.

W6v2

Some of the subs you guys mentioned seems expensive?! like the W7?

Also, would you go for a sub that had a lower "floor" like say 25Hz instead of 35Hz or would you prefer one that only had a floor of 35Hz but could do up to say 500Hz or even 1500Hz?? Is that even of any use?

i dont think idmax is my piece of cake.. since you need a lot to power it, then i would assume that.. its more like the W7. IMO its waaaay to much bass for SQ. Im actually already getting enough base from my splits but a little more would be nicer =) so.. maybe ill get xtant or infinity. Does anyone know how much would infinity kappa perfect would cost in 10"?

Hi atsq2

I've heard most of the subs listed above and if price comes under consideration, Xtant X104 would definitely be the choice. It is about $500.

good luck with your purchase

Thanks Anthony, I will add that one to my list... where would you buy xtant stuff? Andii the kappa perfect is available in hi fi supermarket Victoria and regardless of what the rrp is meant to be, you can bargain them down to 450 or less quite easily.

Diamond TDX12 is another one to add to your audition list.

Concur 10w3v2 suggestion.

For subs, you generally use a low-pass filter at about 80Hz or so, some ppl go a bit lower or higher, but you certainly don't need the sub to play up to 500Hz, (let alone 1500Hz). This is the midbass-midrange region which your splits will handle.

For SQ, imo, you want a sub that will play nice and low, so to answer your question, I'd definately go for the sub with the lowest extension (while retaining good sq).

Just remember, manufacturers put wild claims on their subs as to the frequency range that they can play. And if you are looking to use a compact enclosure, it will likely have to be sealed; most subs don't play as low in a sealed enclosure (compared to a ported one). So make sure you get the real specs on the subs you are looking at and don't just trust the manufacturers claimed frequency range.

I would suggest that you would be looking for a relatively high Qts, low fs and low-mid Vas in order to get good results in a small sealed enclosure.

Cool! Thanks. Now, to find a sub that fits what you mentioned... hmmm

Infinity can be got at the Lifestyle stores in Sydney.

What amp do you intend to power it with? As you said the sub was the 4th of 4 components I assume the PGTi500 is your only amp. It makes about 250WRMS bridged into 2 channels. So unless you intend to give your sub more power later on you need to choose a sub that will give it's best with 250W. Most of the subs mentioned above need more power than this to give you value for money. I put my money on the IDQ10v2d2. It will go quite low and loud in a tiny sealed box with 250W and sound as sweet as.

so how big a box can you accommodate?

you really need to know before looking at the subs; or at least know which subs aren't suitable purely coz they require a big box or, like the IDMAX, are physically huuuuuge.

so determine the max internal volume of the box and go from there. however, most of the quality subs mentioned need no more than 1.2cuft sealed (if indeed they warrant a sealed box). and that's not too big and hopefully will fit.

i'd add the diamond audio M6 to your list. the TDX sub already mentioned is physically big too (very deep mount).

yet another is the hertz air mille series. if you go sealed with these, the box requirement are about as tiny as you'll find. a 10" sub needs around 11~15L. like, what the? :shock:

Yeah pretty much a small sealed box and about 200W-250W RMS will be all I can afford to feed it.

Ideally, I'd like it to have a low frequency floor like 35Hz or less (actual - not specs)... but I don't know how one would tell if they could or not without actually testing.

Is the Hertz, Diamond Audio, or IDQ10v2d2 all under $500?

the IDQ should be under $500.

the hertz and DA M6 will be close to that i think. the 12" versions retail a little over $600. so hopefully the 10" ones come in well under that.

I just need to point out that sub bass CAN be turned up and down... Too much bass? Turn it down. Not enough bass? Turn it up.
The Brahma, JL W7, and IDMax are subs that are designed for exceptional SQ at all volume levels... Even extremely high volume levels

Also, to all the people recommending IDMax... They only come in 12's according to their website, so they don't help someone looking for a 10.

Anyway, now that you've told us your power and price limitations, i'd say IDQ10v2 aswell

Download WinISD (it's freeware). It lets you model the response of any sub in a sealed enclosure by simply inputting the Vas, fs and Qts of the sub (you can put in the rest of the TS specs if you like, but they have no affect on a sealed box response). It lets you vary the internal volume of the box, and you can see the change in the subs response. WinISD calculates the response using the standard formulas given in Vance Dickason's publications, so I'd guess it's pretty accurate...

IDMAX10 is available, the US website is not really up to date. The 10 is $749 rrp and available in dual 2 and dual 4 ohm voice coil models. IDMAX15 is under development!

Thanks for the help... now where do I go about buying an ID sub or Diamond or Hertz?

$399 is the c7urrent ticket price for the 10" Xtant HEX sub at hi-fi supermarket ringwood.

just bear in mind that when you look at the response curves, anticipate a bass boost in the really low subbass frequency region when the subbox/sub is place in a car. the confines of a small cabin provide 'gain' that improves subbass. most curves look poor in the 35Hz region on software graphs, but in reality it will be significantly boosted.

I think GL Pro Sound in Essendon does Image Dynamics(IDQ)... best bet would be to contact the distributor, Hutch on here, or email him. His website is below.

http://www.dynmobile.com/

I reckon IDMAX, JL, Brahma, Xtant, Diamond and Hertz are not really ideal for SQ. If you are looking for SQ sub, try the ADS, Focal, Concept, MMATS, Velodyne.

Just curious, what makes these subs unsuitable for SQ?

hee,hee, aside from merely voicing his opinion, i must say most people would disagree like you hutch. :wink:

just curious..
How is xtant X104 sound like if given only 200 watt rms? Will it still have tight, deep base? And how does it work in free air setup?! Thanks in advance...

I second that. What makes them unsuitable? People generally have reasons for their opinions.

Funny to see the Xtant mentioned so much. It's a basically a prettied up MTX Thunder 8000, not that that's a bad thing but no-one ever really seems to say much nice about MTX anymore.

Phil

yeah? i didn't realise the connection there.

from how i see it, mtx has a low profile cos it's not readily available. or is it? at least i can't think of a melbourne retailer with it...not that i've looked at all!

if a W7 is too bassy for you, then i'd go with ultim8DTM5's suggestion of a 10W6v2

It's a common misconception where woofer with very high power handling ability are SPL subs. However, I do think with the right amount of power and a correct designed box any of the subs you mentioned above can become a good SQ sub.

Personally, I would go with the a/d/s or JL W6v2. Xtant is quite good, however you need plenty of power to get the best out of them.

Cheers

If you can afford the ID Max, that would be my first choice, if not I'd go for the ID V3 (there have a bit more excursion than the IDQ V2).

Bye,
Mo

I used to have an MTX6000 Thunder Sub (in MTX made ported box) and it really thumped for the price i paid for it.

They are available at Hi Fi Supermarket.

Anyways thanks everyone who contributed their opinion... You have made me even more indecisive now that I have more options!! Haha... but this is better than making the wrong choice cos I didnt have enuf options.

I love my Boston 10.5lfs great puncy bass in tiny enclosures and also goes very low

That is what i reckon suitable for SQ... JL never make a good sub that is suitable for SQ even W7... try listen to the ADS sub or Phase Linear Aliante... they are not as expensive as JL or Brahma or IDMAX...

What makes me think that Xtant, JL, Brahma and IDMAX not really suitable for SQ coz the bass characteristic not as smooth or soft or detail as Aliante or ADS...

Tat is just my opinion of SQ subs... try the Aliante, ADS or even concept (www.conceptaudio.com) the 10" EX series... i just install 2x10" in me car... it performs hips better than JL, Xtant and Kicker... i used to have xtant, jl and kicker previously... and i reckon Concept kick a$$...

BTW, no offence tho... peace...

yeaa... i agree to that... the ADS subs though dont have a very strong base is a lot more detailed which makes them more suitable for SQ. In an SQ set up, you wouldnt want the bass to dominate the music and that you would want the subs to just preform a low frequency tones as it was recorded.. and not to over play it... just my personal opinion. Have a listen to the ADS R subs... aweesooommeeee!! =)

In that case, try the aliante... for me its better than ADS... but the price is more expensive...

ive already bought a DLS MW 10... =( huu to late to change my mind now.. hehe.. I'll just be happi with it for now.. wanna save up money for 19"!!

same here,

i would never get sick of listning to my 10.5lf
and they can be had for under $500