Since submitting a reply on the topic about MB Quart and Dynaudio not long ago I'm starting to wonder and would like to ask forum members about using home drivers in a car.
We've all heard about people using either Scan Speak or Vifa or Seas drivers, but what about offerings from other makers? I'm not talking about your regular brands like MB Quart, Dynaudio, Focal, etc. I'm talking about esoteric drivers made by high end driver makers that, most likely, you've never heard before (unless you are really into high end audio).
For an example, what about ribbon tweeters? Usually they're the large rectangular type, so fitting a set inside a car would be close to impossible without total interior/dashboard rebuild. But Swans Speaker recently introduced its new ribbon tweeter design, the RT1L that has a diameter of 110 mm or about 4". Roughly the same size as Scan's Ring Radiator. Anyone even thought about getting a set for their cars?
And what about other exotic drivers, such as one with ceramic or diamond (!) membranes currently made by Accuton? Believe it or not, many SQ cars here in Jakarta actually use Venture (Accuton's Far East brand name) tweeters and mids. One astonishing fact is that for a set of ceramic membrane tweeters, the HP can be crossed as low as 500 Hz, making them a set of mid & high range drivers.
Don't forget compression loaded drivers, or horns as it is widely known. No exotic driver makers that I know make them, the only company that makes these horns specifically for cars is Image Dynamics.
Anyone uses these type of exotic drivers, or at least knows someone who has? Would people in Australia willing to go that far for their car audio systems?
Cheers,
Bon
Full Version: Exotic Speakers/Drivers
Companies that make horns for cars:
Crossfire, USD, Image Dynamics and Veritas.
(There are probably more these are the only ones I can think of off the top of my head.)
As far as ribbon tweeters are concerned they really don't have the sort of power handling required for an in car environment.
Most people try to drown out road noise etc with their stereo and require high volume levels as compared to home audio systems that are often in a well deadened room that is perfectly quiet to begin with.
Yes there are people willing to go a long way with our audio systems.
Look in the Showcase section of the forum and you will find a thread about a $70,000 install DD Phil is doing in a Holden Monaro.
I would think you would have to be reasonably comitted to do this to that sort of car.
Crossfire, USD, Image Dynamics and Veritas.
(There are probably more these are the only ones I can think of off the top of my head.)
As far as ribbon tweeters are concerned they really don't have the sort of power handling required for an in car environment.
Most people try to drown out road noise etc with their stereo and require high volume levels as compared to home audio systems that are often in a well deadened room that is perfectly quiet to begin with.
Yes there are people willing to go a long way with our audio systems.
Look in the Showcase section of the forum and you will find a thread about a $70,000 install DD Phil is doing in a Holden Monaro.
I would think you would have to be reasonably comitted to do this to that sort of car.
I just purchased a 3 way set of raw drivers for my SQ install from www.worldsbestspeakers.com
Re: makers of horn drivers, I stand corrected. Thanks for the info.
As for turning up the volume to drown out road noise, why not go the extra length of treating the interior with sound deadening/damping materials? That way if done properly one would have a quiter cabin to begin with, so the components do not have to be pushed hard, making the whole system much more linear.
Which prompts another question: Which one is more effective, treating the interior with sound deadening/damping materials or get a more powerful amplifier and drivers with high sensitivity so you can play louder?
It kinda reminds me of something that a friend of mine once said about modification: it is better to reduce the weight of a car by 10 percent rather than increase engine performance by 10 percent. Somewhat similar doesn't it?
With the Holden Monaro example, was it built for competition only or for personal enjoyment? I would like to know if there are people who go the extra length for that perfect system but use it for personal use with no intention of competing at all. But if they wish to do so the system is more than capable to go head to head with the best of them. There are many of cars with great SQ systems using high end components here in Jakarta but only few would actually go and enter a competition. The rest built their systems for their own use.
Cheers,
Bon
As for turning up the volume to drown out road noise, why not go the extra length of treating the interior with sound deadening/damping materials? That way if done properly one would have a quiter cabin to begin with, so the components do not have to be pushed hard, making the whole system much more linear.
Which prompts another question: Which one is more effective, treating the interior with sound deadening/damping materials or get a more powerful amplifier and drivers with high sensitivity so you can play louder?
It kinda reminds me of something that a friend of mine once said about modification: it is better to reduce the weight of a car by 10 percent rather than increase engine performance by 10 percent. Somewhat similar doesn't it?
With the Holden Monaro example, was it built for competition only or for personal enjoyment? I would like to know if there are people who go the extra length for that perfect system but use it for personal use with no intention of competing at all. But if they wish to do so the system is more than capable to go head to head with the best of them. There are many of cars with great SQ systems using high end components here in Jakarta but only few would actually go and enter a competition. The rest built their systems for their own use.
Cheers,
Bon
So far I have about 40 sheets of sound deadener in my car. Only another 80 or so to go!
(I'm doing the roof and floor too.)
I still wouldn't use ribbon tweeters though. Horns all the way for me!
I know a few people that have built high end systems for their own pleasure.
I would say that from what I have seen of the car stereo industry, most of the people that build high end systems build them to compete or for show.
Maybe others would like to add to this.
(I'm doing the roof and floor too.)
I still wouldn't use ribbon tweeters though. Horns all the way for me!
I know a few people that have built high end systems for their own pleasure.
I would say that from what I have seen of the car stereo industry, most of the people that build high end systems build them to compete or for show.
Maybe others would like to add to this.
i've not physically seen any of these high-end home drivers. but i just wonder if they're robust enough to withstand the rigors of a car environment: changes in temperature and moisture, constant vibrations, etc.
would they be up to it? :?
would they be up to it? :?
All the ones I've seen are.
QUOTE (shiny_car)
i've not physically seen any of these high-end home drivers. but i just wonder if they're robust enough to withstand the rigors of a car environment: changes in temperature and moisture, constant vibrations, etc.
would they be up to it? :?
would they be up to it? :?
Yes and no. Some home drivers aren't as moisture resistant as car audio speakers.
Like I've said before, I'm not a big fan of using home audio speakers in a car. They are built for two different things.
Bye,
Mo
and to think i read the topic as exotic strippers/dancers
i always appreciate new technology and people trying to think outside of the box to bring new innovative ways to improving their audio, be it in the car or at home.
I respect a company such as Sonus Faber a lot because, whilst they do not manufacture their own drivers, they spend heaps and heaps of time to design their speaker boxes to push that extra last bit of performance from the drivers to make them sound just great. The curved back design of the Cremona Auditor's is very ingenious as it prevents rear standing waves building up without purely relying the use of dampening and defusing material. All their designs are also a great piece of artwork which are just timeless imo.
I respect a company such as Sonus Faber a lot because, whilst they do not manufacture their own drivers, they spend heaps and heaps of time to design their speaker boxes to push that extra last bit of performance from the drivers to make them sound just great. The curved back design of the Cremona Auditor's is very ingenious as it prevents rear standing waves building up without purely relying the use of dampening and defusing material. All their designs are also a great piece of artwork which are just timeless imo.
Indeed, there are various companies that experiment on speaker box designs. Look at B&W Nautilus, for starters. I guess I kinda understand the hefty pricetag that they put on the product, not only the materials used and how it is constructed but it also goes toward the R&D costs.
there are heaps of home drivers that i've considered for car use. hiquphon tweets are lovely... and there's lots out there in regard to ribbons and horns... if thats your thing.
when you find these exotic drivers in home speakers, you'll usually find the manufacturer spends many many hours with box/xover design... and few people will go to the same lengths inside a car. you have to ask yourself the question, whether you can justify megabuck drivers for your car without spending lots and LOTS of time setting them up correctly.
personally, i'd stick to speakers packaged and engineered for car use. a set of supremos or esotars or revelators or whatever, set-up correctly, should give you an amazing base to work with anyway! these high-level drivers aren't exactly "non-exotic" anyway... just take sonus fabre/wilson audio - scanspeak/vifa... dynaudio's esotar'd evidence masters ($128,000/pr) or jmlabs grande utopias... you get the drift....
i've always been an advocate of setting up what you've got properly, rather than just upgrading components. and you don't necessarily need the highest of high priced drivers to make a good sound anyway... take cyberpunky's car! the basic dynaudio md-100 tweet is all he needs to make one of the most respected SQ cars in the country!
d
when you find these exotic drivers in home speakers, you'll usually find the manufacturer spends many many hours with box/xover design... and few people will go to the same lengths inside a car. you have to ask yourself the question, whether you can justify megabuck drivers for your car without spending lots and LOTS of time setting them up correctly.
personally, i'd stick to speakers packaged and engineered for car use. a set of supremos or esotars or revelators or whatever, set-up correctly, should give you an amazing base to work with anyway! these high-level drivers aren't exactly "non-exotic" anyway... just take sonus fabre/wilson audio - scanspeak/vifa... dynaudio's esotar'd evidence masters ($128,000/pr) or jmlabs grande utopias... you get the drift....
i've always been an advocate of setting up what you've got properly, rather than just upgrading components. and you don't necessarily need the highest of high priced drivers to make a good sound anyway... take cyberpunky's car! the basic dynaudio md-100 tweet is all he needs to make one of the most respected SQ cars in the country!
d
Just in case anyone misunderstood my topic and posts, I do not preach/advocate the use of home drivers in cars. I just want to know if there are people using them in their car setup...
I wholeheartly agree that if set up correctly any type of driver will produce a great sound, and yes you do not need the most expensive driver out there to get great sound.
It's just...I dunno, maybe it boils down to my lack of listening experience. Here I'm surrounded by people using home drivers in their cars. If they are using car speakers it is usually the top of the line version, rarely do I get the chance of listening to some great speakers with a pricetag that won't burn my wallet. Except one, and that's the Morel Hybrid 5 component set. Easy on the pocket, great sounding splits with warm tonality, good details and quite accurate in its sonic reproduction.And I hear that the Ovation series are even better...
Bon
I wholeheartly agree that if set up correctly any type of driver will produce a great sound, and yes you do not need the most expensive driver out there to get great sound.
It's just...I dunno, maybe it boils down to my lack of listening experience. Here I'm surrounded by people using home drivers in their cars. If they are using car speakers it is usually the top of the line version, rarely do I get the chance of listening to some great speakers with a pricetag that won't burn my wallet. Except one, and that's the Morel Hybrid 5 component set. Easy on the pocket, great sounding splits with warm tonality, good details and quite accurate in its sonic reproduction.And I hear that the Ovation series are even better...
Bon
The problem is many home audio drivers (particularly tweeters) do not have a suitable off axis response to be used in most installs. Tuning the crossovers also takes some effort. It can work very well but obviously it is more difficult.
Those people that do use alternative drivers such as Scan Speak or Vifa or Seas etc do so, because they produce a reasonably large range, so there may be a few drivers that are suitable for car audio.
Those people that do use alternative drivers such as Scan Speak or Vifa or Seas etc do so, because they produce a reasonably large range, so there may be a few drivers that are suitable for car audio.
dude you should have a listen to some dynaudio offerings. if you like morel, you're pretty much guaranteed to not dislike the dyns.
all the buttery smoothness, naturalness, richness and cleanliness that makes music so great can be found in pretty much all dyn's systemXXX packages.
i'm still in awe at how good a well installed set of dyns can sound.
d
all the buttery smoothness, naturalness, richness and cleanliness that makes music so great can be found in pretty much all dyn's systemXXX packages.
i'm still in awe at how good a well installed set of dyns can sound.
d
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