ok i would like to know peoples opinions on good audio products for a complete system. i am only interested in sq, although loud without distortion would be nice too. i wont be buying anything until next year as i am currently in denmark until december, but i would like to know what brands there are out there that people are interested in! i will have about $5000 to spend all up and have broken that down into categories i thought appropriate:

Head unit = $700

Front Splits = $1200

Rear splits = $400

4 channel amp = $800

Subwoofer = $800

Sub amp = $1000

also what do people think about buying off ebay? i have seen MB Quart for sale at a very much reduced price. i know warranty and things become a problem when u buy from overseas, but my thinking is that if u pay %40 of the rrp then u can afford it to break once......? maybe not...

there are variations of the money breakdown. i.e i plan to get a coupe, prelude, supra, 280zx, so rear splits may not be necessary if they would be anyway.....and also a sub isnt completely necessary to begin with, so i could put more money into front splits or head unit or amp....i know wiring and installation is important, but i plan to do that myself if i bought off ebay as the warranty is for 1 year whether it is installed by proffesionals or not. i will listen to various brands in melbourne as i plan to buy my car there also.

thanks.

with a $5k budget, this should get you started, but is by no means an exhaustive list

HU's: Clarion, Eclipse, Alpine, Nakamichi

Splits: Boston, Rainbow, Phass, Digital Designs, Eton, Diamond, Focal

Speaker Amps: Audison, Boston, Digital Designs, ARC, Tru Tech, Zapco

Subs: Image Dynamics, Resnonant Engineering, Digital Designs, Boston, Diamond, Kicker

Sub Amps: Tru Tech, Audison, Digital Designs, E-audio, Earthquake

- Stooge007 out

get rid of the rear splits

this money will cover wiring and sub box.

eg stinger 1/0 gauge package approx $200

1/0 gauge to dual output 4 gauge fused splitter (stinger expert looks great but costs a lot $100)

rcas $60 two sets

speaker wire 12gauge- 16gauge $2 to $4 per meter

custom sub box approx $300 without paint or carpet.


if you feel you need rear speakers you can get these at a later date

4 channel amp is a good idea since it can be used in 2 channel mode for the front splits only or in 4 channel mode to run the front and rears. Very flexible amp to use.

amps i can recommened the eclipse PA5422 4 channel amp 4 x85watts rms or 2 x240watts rms (perfect for your front stage) RRP $799 very highly recommend this amp. It is just incredible. Definitely one of my favorites.

jlaudio e4300 approx$500, jlaudio 4/300 approx$700 4 channels are also nice.

sub amp xenon 1200.1 or jlaudio 1000/1 nice option approx $1200 both these amps are very flexible and allow different sub setups.

sub idmax, jlaudio w7, re xxx, adire audio brahma v2 $900-$1400

head unit isnt critical so anything around $500 plus will have the features you are after. Look at the now old model alpines for a good deal, 9833 maybe

splits focal utopia, focal k2power, dynaudio, alpine (yes alpine) are very good choices (mbq and boston are meant to be good too)

when you choose great front stage then you HAVE to choose a custom install. This will cost a lot but will be be the best investment in the system. This will make or break your system.

good luck

What they sadi abotu droppig the rear speakers - if you have $5kt o spend buy from someone you'll get good bakcup support from.

is this for sq or spl? if sq u don't need to spent almost $2000 for sub and sub amp, $1000 for both the sub and the amp is more than enough, u hardly use the sub in sq, sq is rely heavily on the split.

so spend more on split + hu +amp ($3000 for all of this) and for sub and sub amp ($1000 is enough), and the last $1000 spend on custom boot instalation (a basic one will cost u around $1000)

honestly i always wonder, why people who said that they after sq, more willing to spend lots money on monoblock and sub which is hardly use, and spend less on HU which is the brain of your system.

I dont know about kicker subs being sq? they are more spl too my ears.

dont buy overseas off ebay, it could cost you more in the long run.

Buying products already in australia normally isn't too much hassle, but warranty is an issue. I have brought many things from ebay and never had a problem. Except a cheap dvd player i brought is abit dodgy, but it was cheap/cheap brand too.

talk to people here, some people are retailers/own their own shops. and you can also recieve the CAA discount, so you may find prices almost as cheap as ebay, even if it does cost more, least you got warranty

If you dump the rear speakers, you will regret it. They make the staging MUCH easier.

No, they are not essential, but it's considerably more difficult to get the sound stage in line with the headrests (or just in front of, to be precise) when all the speakers are in front of you.

btw why do u want the sound stage to be in line with the headreast? the good sound stage should coming on top of the hood, way beyond your windscreen

This is what I would call the 'ideal' soundstage:



This is how I find a simple, front speakers only setup:



This what I feel rear speakers attain cheaply:


They drag the corners of the sound stage back... which give it that extra touch of realism. Whilst the signal is linear to both speakers (ie left and right playing same noise), the difference is not so great. However, when a particular sound shifts to one edge of the sound stage, it seems to be coming directly out of the speaker, which is unfortunately a good two feet in front of my head. In my experience, rear speakers allow you to drag the edges rearward a bit, so that the corners sound about a half foot in front of you.

It's definitely not a substitute for some amazingly setup systems (Audioquest has achieved close to that perfect curve, as has Mr_Bob), but it's a hell of a lot cheaper.

Note this is just my experience and my preferences...

Take a look at the top SPL subs, then take a look at the top SQ subs.
RE, DD, Type X's. Mostly the lists will be the same, as a sub that has the excursion to go loud at 60Hz+ has the excursion to create 40Hz- with great clarity. L7's are nice subs, the box is the major factor.

for that monay I would go DLS Ultimate A calss A7 would run the whole system. with DLS ultimate iredium 6.3 splits. for sub I would go Image dynamic IDQ10. HU go for eclipse 8454 as I like the look more than the new eclipse.
this will workout within your budget

im after good sq with splits and everything working properly, but i also mentioned i wouldnt mind loud.....but sq is much more important.

as far as i can see just about all head units are the same except for the display. incredibly general statement i know, but as far as im concerned, there is no noticeable difference in sq between a $700 Hu and a $1500 HU. how much more useful technology can there possibly be? i also believe speakers have a bigger part to play in sq than the HU!!! i.e i would much rather a cheap HU with excellent splits, as opposed to an excellent HU with cheap splits...there is only so much the brain can do without reasonable appendages!

although still a long way away from actually purchasing anything, this place [removed] would be the most likely place to buy something. or a similar website.

please have no doubt i have no idea what im talking about which was the initial idea behind posting here.

thanks for the posts so far!

I'm going to completely disagree with you there.

Yes a good front stage makes or breaks a system. But a TOP quality subwoofer being given nice clean power is ESSENTIAL. "you hardly use the sub in sq" is very wrong.... yes, it isn't amazingly loud, but it's performance is crucial to making the response at ALL FREQUENCIES linear, from 20kHz to 20Hz. it gives more oomph to your front stage, just adding that slight depth to the bass tones up front, and plays the 20-70Hz region with clarity and precision.

If you feel that because the subwoofer isn't running for SPL and it's not worth the money, I equally disagree. After I set my car up for the CAASQ comp (where, incidentally, I had turned the bass down just a touch too far), I found that putting through certain Hip Hop tracks still demanded a massive response from the subwoofer. You do not give away those frequencies unnecesarily.

And unless you're Audioquest, I highly doubt you'll hear the difference between a $700 and a $1500 headunit. better to spend that $800 on a processor if you're serious.

ok so i had a look at [removed] and although they dont have as much as i had hoped for, their products seem good:


Alpine CDA-9855 - MP3 Player
CD-R/RW, MP3/WMA Playback, 3 PreOuts (4V), 50w x 4, SwingFace GlideTouch, Time Correction, HP/LP Digital Crossover, Biolite Display, 5-Band EQ. $750.00


Phoenix Gold Ti6 Comp Elite - 6" Ti Comp Elite Splits
2 Way Component System, 6 inch midbass, 1.1 inch tweeter, 300WRMS / 600W Peak, High quality performance level. $700.00


Alpine SPR-17LP - 6.5" Type R Coaxials
6.5" Coaxial 2 ways, 250W Peak, 50WRMS, 1" Soft Dome tweeter, Multi-layered Hybrid Fiber Cone. $285.00


Phoenix Gold Ti12DE - 12" Ti Elite Sub
• 12 inch dual 4 ohm subwoofer
• 3 inches peak to peak excursion
• Optimized for a small 0.75 sealed enclosure
• Tri LED illuminated diaphragm
• 1200WRMS / 2000W Peak $1,100.00


Phoenix Gold R15.0:1 - Monoblock Octane R Series
Class D Amp, 1 x 500 Watts RMS @ 4 OHM, 1 x 1000 Watts RMS @ 2 OHM, Variable LP crossover, Variable Subsonic filter, LPL. $665.00


Kicker KX650.4 - 4 Channel KX Series
KX Series Amplifier, 170WRMS x 4 @ 2 ohm, 325WRMS x 4 @ 4ohm, Remote bass control, Cooling fan. $600.00


Total: $4100

although perhaps the subwoofer seems a bit excessive!

but for a first time car audio set-up how would that go? because i really dont think i would complain!

STAZED:
i'm not audioquest, but i honestly hear huge different between $700 hu (my clarion dxz 715) and $1500 hu (my alpine 7998r), and if u havent hear what a $4000 HU can do to your system, pls don't say head unit is less important than sub.

and for the sub, well maybe i choose the wrong word, not hardly use, should be "use but very little", my fre use Denon DCT-R1, 2 Phass Hp amp, Morel Supremo, Seas Exel mid, custom crossover, and only use Alpine type R and caustic amp, its more than enough for sq

while my system, if u see my sig, i use kicker L7 myself, definetly not for sq factor, but more for look, and sq sometimes can be boring, so a bit spl is necesary.

so i guess in this case we have our own opinion.

just my 2 cents

That site is not actually an australian company. They send from south east Asia, and thus no warranty will be valid by any Australian store/company.

"[removed] was established in May 2003 with the purpose of providing high performance car audio electronics to the public at prices everyone can afford. We are a registered business situated in Perth, Australia and have had several years of online retail experience on the online auction site eBay"

"Should an item become defective after the initial inspection, our company will cover the exchange/repairs for a period of 1 year from the date of purchase. Our In-House warranty covers parts and labor on items deemed to have a manufacturer defect subject to the terms and conditions outlined by the manufacturer."

"All shipping and packaging costs are FREE!

All orders are sent via Australia Post or FedEx Australia."

"Nearly every month we offer special prices on a selection of products. These items are in stock in WA, ready to be posted."

ok so it doesnt worry me if they ship from asia, because they do have a 1 year warranty and shipping is free....

True, 1 year warranty by them. If they still exist in 1 years time, and they're competent, i'm sure you will be fine.

Maybe it's just me, but I wouldn't be spending $5000 on components that have absolutely no manufacturer's warranty.

no well i wouldnt either if it wasnt so much cheaper there. ill be buying a car in melbourne i reckon (i will be living in tassie), so i can have a look around the shops while im there...

bodyjar: i bought my pioneer deck off [removed]. my brother has also bought 3 decks, and 1 apline type x sub from him delivered straight to our door. i personally know the owner himself.

Maybe so, but I'm not sure why you addresses that to bodyjar - his statement that there will be no warranty valid with any authorised australian supplier or distributor of this product is entirely correct.

good point.

sorry body jar, i thought u were taking a stab at him thats all

ok dude i had the same outlook when looking for a sq system - mine has now sorta turned out multi-purpose and have a few diff eq settings and stuff like that for change of situation.

i have alpine 9815 -- you could prob go for alpine 9835 but ive also heard (by word of mouth) that eclipse are prob better for sq.

i went for a good set of 2 way dynaudio splits - go the 2 ways or 3 ways.

get a decent amp which will power these -- need at least 100rms for 2 ways and at least 200rms for 3 ways. You will get the most out of these speakers if you power them properly.

i have an 'ok' set of - alpine type s (as rear fill) but nothing too special -- if you're buying id suggest some alpine type S's/R's or some cheaper focals -- i personally wouldnt go all out on rear speakers - dont need to worry bout amplifying these. (If you have a coupe not as essential to have them but it give a more fulfilling sound imo. But if you get a sedan still spend the same amount but id say you should have them in there).

Sub/s -- now at times i like to hear bass other times i want to hear everything in balance. So i have opted for 2 Type R's ($400ea) which are probably just above middle of the road in terms of sq. Some other options would be image dynamics, focal, Diamond Audio.

Front Split Amp: 2 options -- get a 4 channel amp and run active, or a 2 channel amp and run passive. People have differing opinions on this and also depends on your splits so i wouldnt go active unless you know wut you're doing or some1 is doing it for you.
Some suggestions for amps ::
4 channels- Eclipse EA3442, Eclipse PA5422.
2 channels- Eclipse EA2212, Eclipse PA4212.

Sub amp ::
depends what you're powering BUT
Around 1000wrms amp = Alpine MRD- M1001 or new model MRD-M1005, Arc Audio 1500XXk Amp.

Around 500wrms = Alpine MRD-M501 or new model MRD-M605, Go with a smaller eclipse mono/2channel.

I have something around this setup and it gives me sq + loudness -- and all i have to do is adjust eq and change a few other things. So if you want a multi-purpose system, this has worked for me ... Other people say DigitalDesigns has been good for SQ + Loudness.

Hope this gives you a few ideas mate

generally yes, BUT a HU with a good EQ and Time Delays and the likes are very important for SQ in terms of staging and overall sound.



i personally havent heard the difference, but it doesnt matter because for his system a $4000 HU is out of the question and is excessive for an new person to SQ. The difference between a $700 headunit and a $4000 HU mite very well be noticable, but for his purposes the difference between a $700 HU and a $1500 would probably be quite minimal depending on brand. Imo comparing clarion to alpine is like comparing boss to eclipse. They aren't toast and butter so you cant compare price difference between brands

one thing tho - make sure if you have $5k dont leave any change -- get the best and expect the best for your budget. Most importantly is get good quality connections through your battery terminals, fuses, soldering, cable, ground, connections to amp, etc. You can spend $5k but it wont be noticable unless you spend up in this area too.

I've seen an apline 9855 for $750. So I would be getting that if I was buying now. I want to install everything myself though, so Ii can save on installation fees, as they can be extremely expensive and put the money towards better speaker wire and cables etc...

There are quite a few months to pass before I am actually buying, so prices and products are sure to change.

if they have an ABN doesnt that mean they are an australian business?
Doesnt every australian company selling car audio import the gear from asia?

No company which imports car audio gear sells it.
No company which sells car audio gear imports it.

One company will establish itself as the distributor, and that company is the only one that is legally able to supply the product to retailers. If a retailer wants a certain amplifier, he contacts the distributor in Australia - he doesn't call his mates in Asia. (which is precisely what this website in question does - buys products from Asian retail stores at tiny margins above wholesale price, then sell it here.)

And no, the gear is imported from wherever it is produced. Where the product is manufactured is not the question here - lets say 5 crates of Rockford amps are produced, one each is sent to Australia, Indonesia, Thailand, Hong Kong and United States. The amplifiers which were sent to Australia are the only ones which will be fixed under Australian warranty. And in most cases, the Australian repairer won't even fix them at YOUR cost.

I cannot stress enough, whatever possible cost savings you're looking at, they aren't worth it.

well alpines new range comes out soon - so you can either buy now and save a bit or buy later and have the latest gear.

1 thing tho definitely dont buy from overseas places -- i could buy myself a business name if i wanted to complete with an ABN worth $1... so basically if some1 tries to sue me then can sue my company which would be worth all of $1 ...

since when clarion has the same level as boss? have u ever heard DXZ715? DXZ 935? the dolphin clarion HU? HX-D1? i have heard all of this clarion HU, and they are wonderfull, there's no way a cheapo boss can be compare to clarion. and i think its a fair comparison between alpine and clarion. i think its very insulting to comparing boss with clarion

ok so as opposed to starting a new thread, i'll just post here.

ive had a bit too much time lately and as a result have been looking about a bit. i read the Fhrx Studio's guide to certain setups:

http://www.caraudioaustralia.com/forums/sh...ead.php?t=41761

and decided i liked the look of certain components in the 20k range.

so i went hunting about and after becoming extremely overwhelmed and having 17 different web pages open and tryng to sort stuff out, came up with this:

Head Unit:
Alpine CDA-7998R

OR

Clarion HX-D2

Front Speakers:
Morel Elate 6 (3-way)

OR

Eton Adventure A2 160

OR

Phoenix Gold Ti6 Comp Elite

OR

Dynaudio 240GT

OR

Morel Elate 6

OR

Rainbow CS 265 Profi Vanadium Phase Plug )

Amplifier(Fronts):
Phoenix Gold X200.4

Sound Deadener:
Dynamat Xtreme Door Kit

Subwoofer:
JL 12JLW6V2

Amplifier (Subwoofer):
Phoenix Gold X600.1

Now there are no wires or cables or cup holders mentioned, but dont worry as I have thought about those and included them in my price thoughts.

ok so here come the questions:

Which head unit? Which splits? Would i need to show the pg ti6 300WRMS or would 200 do and run some rears off the x200.4 amp too? Any thoughts on subwoofers? How would the one i've listed go? I am soley working with sq now, therefore doof doof isnt important unless necessary in part of a song...

thanks for the help:D