Hi fellow forum members,

I have been having some issues with my system and would like to ask for some advice on what area I should improve.

My system consists of:

Pioneer DEH-P6850MP Head Unit
Boston S60 Splits - off Pioneer GM-3100T Amp.
Pioneer W305C Sub - off bridged Jaycar 2x150W Amp
In a VT Commodore.

My issue is with the front stage. I seem to have distortion when many instruments are playing. It is noticable in the midbass and midrange.
Some songs sound great, especially things like acoustic guitars or orchestral instruments, but only when there is one or two instruments playing. As soon as the song builds and you have drums, guitars, vocals in a chorus the sound starts to compress and become mish moshed. I have tried recordings like an older Chesky disc, and it sounds very good, but rock like Powderfinger sounds horrible.
I have been listening to Augie March, and this sounds quite good, except for the rockier songs which also suffer this mish mosh.

I play the music up to a volume where I can hear the detail. To remove all of this distortion by attenuating the volume, I lose a lot of detail.

I have done some basic deadening with flashtac in the doors and sealed the inner skins.

I was wondering where people think I should look at for improving the sound. Is my amplifier not up to the job of good SQ?
Or is my issue more likely with the woofers, and would installing them with MDF rings rather than the stock plastic spacers make a big difference. Or reflections from the windscreen? As I have installed the splits in the stock locations with the tweeters under the grill in the corner of the dash.
I have tried re-aiming the tweeters and have improved the sound a little, removed some sibilance and got a bit of an image happening.

I have played around with the gains, but turning them down just loses detail and means I have to turn the volume up louder. More gain makes the problem worse.

I have heard good things about the Bostons, but I just haven't been able to reproduce clear, all round good quality sound.

How much do you want to spend is really the question?

I would probably look at proper sound deadening, a new amp as well for the fronts. Or perhaps a new mono and use the Jaycar to power the speakers?

Though could also be the speakers not up to par?

Well I don't have a lot to spend, being a uni student.

I was planning on doing some deadening, but I'd rather fix this distortion issue before I do that.

What I should be asking is if anyone has experience with the small pioneer amps and whether they are up to the job? Or is it more likely an install issue.

I don't think the Bostons are the weak link, but would be happy to be told otherwise.

what are your crossover points set at?

Do you have your fronts high passed?

also you might want to check your gains on both amps

You definatly want to lose the plastic baffles and use mdf. You also want to make sure the woofers are sealed when you do. You *may* want to consider swapping you alps around and lowering your gains. Don't be afraid of using the volume control, as its not a bad thing to have to turn it up to get loud. If its loud at a low volume setting then you just have less usable range(fine adjustment).

If you have gotten to max vol at say 5 you have a choice of 5 stages of volume...if you can go to 35 then you can get it just right for situation say 23 at 60 ks aand 27 at 80 ks and 35 at 100 ks. Its like adding sugar to coffee. You wouldnt want to add it by the half cup full...none or too much. You use a spoon coz it allows you to get it just right.

Personally I like to set up a system so it does distort, a little, at max volume(if you have a lower powered system) with a really dynamic (loud) cd. This way you have little in the tank for quiet CDs, and you can just avoid using max Vol on more dynamic CDs. In my system I have enough power that I can crank any CD at max without distortion because it has more volume than I normally use.

All your flash tac is doing is making you feel better you did something, but in reality you need to use genuine SD products to get a benefit you can hear.
peace
Cyberpunky

Thanks for your help so far guys.

I will fix up the mounts for the woofers and do them properly with MDF.

I have tried a lot of mucking around with the gains, as I said in my first post. If I turn them down I still get this issue.
I really don't think this is a problem with the gains.

I was more wondering about the performance of the Pioneer amp and whether anyone had the same issues with sound compressing, and having fixed that. I have a little bit of money to spend, and I want to know where you guys think would be best to use it to fix up this issue, as I have put a lot of money and time into this system and can't get it to a point that I like.



I'm not running an active setup, so I'm using the passive crossovers.

Fronts are high passed, yes. Have fiddled between 63Hz and 100Hz and found 80Hz gives a good balance between clarity and up-front bass.

looks like your on top of most of the basic answers to this problem so from here it gets a little harder to diagnose. Some pictures of the gears locations may help you or just take it to your local shop. You said the drivers were in stock locations, could the cone of the woofer be hitting the door trim? this could cause anything from a bit of muddy-ness if its only just touching to a loud slapping noise, thisissomething you will have to be carefull of when making the new mdf baffles, leave pleanty of clearance. definately follow the other suggestions as well, you will love the difference deadening makes and if your feeling ambitious try angling the drivers towards you, almost nothing else will make a bigger difference when looking for clarity. good luck with it.

Thanks a lot for the help.

I have played a bit more around with the gains and eq and I think i've got that the best I can get it now.
I am definitely going to change the mountings for the woofers to MDF rings, and I might try lowering them so they arent so obstructed and angle them up.

I checked, and it looks like there is plenty of room behind the trim, so the cone shouldnt be hitting anything.
I will also grab some more deadener and finish off the doors, as well as do the boot.

If all else fails I might go to one of the Sydney sponsor shops and get them to have a look.

What you are lacking is what's called "resolution" and it's not cheap to fix.
Once you have the installation done right, you may well have the same problem, but to a lesser extent.
Only upgrading the components will solve this.

I was having a similar problem , i tried everything ... until i moved the tweeters close to the mids, like no further than 6" apart and on the same axis, fixed the problem.

Haha, read your post in your thread. Didn't really think of moving the tweeters nearer to the mids, but I will definitely try that once my exams are done!