Hi guys,

I currently have an old clarion head unit, and it really doesn't match the rest of my gear. it is in the entry level catagory, and is letting down the rest of my system. It's the model DB336MP, so it has 1 pair of RCA preouts, basic fade controls and bass, treble controls.

What I'm after is something with
1) TA
2) Variable HP/LF filters
3) EQ's
4) stable tracking of a CD.
6) Good sound quality
7) Solid buttons and relatively easy use.


At the moment, I will say pioneer is out of the question as far as HU goes. None of their HU's really appeal to me. Clarion I have found to be really good in terms of their reliability in the past, and would definately consider something in their range.

Now I guess my question is, would I be able to put the PXA-H701 through the RCA output of the clarion and maintain controlability of the PXA. Can you forsee any problems?

Option 1 - get a whole new HU, which I think will end up being the better option. If this is the case, which HU would you get if you had a budget of up to around 1.3k? Most importantly, can you say why you chose that one?

Option 2 - Go with the PXA. It would add most of the functions I need and stay aroudn the same cost as other top end HU's, though it may be comprimised through the Clarion.

To give you an idea of the rest of the system, it is Audison VRx amps, PG TI Elite sub and dyn splits (TBC)

Thoughts?

with the H701 u have the capacity of upgrading ur HU later on to something like a dvd player etc.

if u r goin for SQ tho, its probably better to go with a better SQ orientated deck. they probably wont have the 31 band EQ or auto TA (not that is any good IMO) but u will probably get better SQ.

reason for this is that the DAC in a good HU will will be on par or better than the DAC in the 701 (although i am not very sure about this, depends on the HU u get i suppose). u will have to run digital out from ur HU to the H701 so u avoid the DAC in ur current HU in order to increase the SQ BUT u will have to get the PXA H701 controller which will add $$.

so IMO u have these choices

u run with the H701 with controller which will use up ur budget OR u could get a new HU.

advantages, the H701 has 8 ch xovers so u can run active front and sub. it also has the 31 band EQ and auto time alignment if thats wat u wanted.

disadvantages is that u need digital out on ur existing HU to keep up with SQ of a better unit. whether it does or not i have no idea.

or u could buy a new HU that may or may not have 8 ch xovers and probably wont have a 31 band EQ.

thats the way i see it neway.

i recommend only to use an alpine Ai-NET HU with alpine PXA processors. this is cos you use, as normal, the volume control/fader/balance/sublevel from the HU. if you use a non-alpine HU, you can no longer use the HU's controls. instead, the HU volume must be 'set and forget', just like a home CD player with fixed-output level. then you rely on the alpine RUX-C701 remote control face (extra $499) to do all the controlling; it becomes your new 'HU face', with controls for volume/fader/balance/sublevel and all the settings for the tuning.

you will still need the RUX with most alpine HUs, but you can hide it away or at least it will look similar to the HU in the dash, and you retain the controls on the HU.

the analogue audio signal via the Ai-NET cable remains excellent compared with a digital signal. most people cannot hear the difference, so not an issue in nearly all cases.



i think this is a good option. alpine's high-end models - those featuring 'bass engine pro' tuning features - will suit your needs, with TA, 5-band parametric EQ, and inbuilt xovers. the PXA-H701 processor is a bit better, with 8 channel output, option of parametric EQ or 31-band graphic EQ, and dolby digital processing should you need it.

other HU's to consider would be:
*eclipse
*blaupunkt bremen

or even spend more. given the alpine processor/remote face will retail at $1500, and you may buy an alpine HU, you could consider some other HUs like:
*clarion HX-D2
*kenwood

Would you recommend the alpine F1 7990R as a source unit? Reason is that there is one for sale in the forums and I think I may be able to stretch out my budget to meet it. Shiny, would it be usable on it's own as a stand alone unit? Or do I need a processor to go with it? I'm really just after the one unit at the moment, but possibly in the future I could stretch to the processor as well.

Also if I did go the F1 route, would the newer processors be compatible?

I think I need to go out there and just play with the things....

the 7990R alone won't meet your needs. it lacks the tuning features - EQ, TA, xovers - and is purely a CD transport/preamp/tuner (no internal amps, not that you probably need them).

you must add a processor to have the tuning features. now given most people don't wish to fork out anything close to $5K for a processor - let alone more - you may be limited to alpine's PXA-H701 processor. this processor remains excellent and within reach of many people. to me, it doesn't make good sense to have a 7990 'merely' to team it with the H701 processor.

the 7990R is NOT compatible with the new processor. alpine have a new 'bus' system (ION-bus), other than Ai-NET on their new F1 gear.

so to have a 7990R, you either don't add a processor - fullstop - or you add the 'old' PXA-H900 processor. but good luck finding one (processor), and price can vary (original RRP$6999). given how few there are in australia (not really sure, but presumably no more than 30 or so), i don't like your chances. i also found there's a small but significant improvement with the H900 processor over the lesser ones, but no significant improvement between the 7990R and other alpine HUs if you rely solely on the digital output, which of course you would with such a combo. if you compared the 7990R alone vs another HU - no processor - the 7990R is simply superior and worth considering but lacking the tuning features.

a top combo - for both value and performance - is one of alpine's digital-output HUs and the H700/701 processor. HUs that have digital output incl: CDA-7998R, 7969R, 7949R and 7939R. the 7998/7969 alone are excellent HUs, with 'bass engine pro' tuning (TA, 5-band parametric EQ, full xovers), but only 6 channel output. do you actually need/want 8 channel output? if so, you can simply 'split' 1 pair into 2 to create 2 extra channels. and if you don't need digital output, then simply one of alpine's high-end HUs like the 9853/9855 may suit your needs - these are as comprehensive as the 7998/7969, and only lack the digital output which you won't need if you don't add the processor (even then, the analogue audio connection remain excellent and most people cannot hear the difference!).

summary of my opinion:
*7990R alone: awesome SQ HU; lacks tuning features; can tuning features on cheaper HUs narrow the gap to this HU - very much so
*7990R + H900 processor: about as good as it ever gets incl HDCD and 11ch output; extremely expensive and rare
*7990R + H700/701 processor: waste of money to have the 7990R
*7998/similar + H700/701 processor: excellent, top value combo; as good as 99.99% of people want/need
*7998/similar alone: excellent HU; lacks very little compared with above (lesser EQ, 6ch instead of 8ch)
*9853/9855: excellent HUs; lack little-to-nothing compared with above except digital output
*totally different HU: clarion HX-D2, etc

I was in almost EXACTLY the same situation as you. My stock clarion headunit (lancer) was fantastic for a stock unit, but was lacking. Just...lacking. The rear fading preout (1 set) etc...just wasnt cutting it. Then one of the buttons stopped working, and it was time to move on.

For many of the above reasons, plus integration with stackers/screens/amps, i chose an alpine 9835.

A few reasons.
Over its competing brands, the alpines seem to offer a very easy to use menu. Its not as intuitive as others, but very quick and powerful once you realise a few simple shortcuts (such as pressing the rotary control or the menu button 5 times in any menu usually gets you to a "return" screen, and whenever the "back" option comes up, to go back a folder, the audible beep on button press is a different note).

Alpine have the handy on-face folder browsing button's for mp3 discs.
Alpine offered the best trade, to me, between SQ, functionality, and bling.
Tilt face, along with the bio-lite display lets me see the screen in any lighting conditions.

If you use the online "i-personalise" service, you can set up your crossovers, time alignment, and opening message before you ever see your headunit.

Alpine hu's are also the only ones who learnt and wished me happy birthday.

The difference was amazing. All of a sudden, i could hear left/right pans that i didnt know existed with my previous stocker.

The reason i went for the 9835 over newer/more expensive models were

1) Cheaper than one with digital output, and as mentioned, if setup properly the differences are barely audible.
2) Better, in my view, than the new 9855. Both because i find the glidetouch a joke, and feels cheap, and also because the 9855 doesnt feature a on-face tilt control. Its now a menu option. Considering how much i use the tilt function, that would have become a f***ing pain in the ass with the 9855.
3) i got a deal on the 9835
4) I dont think i'll be buying a processor and other amps to go active any time soon. Hence, the 9835 does everything i need, NOW.
5) when i do expand, as mentioned above the alpine headunit will painlessly integrate with various amps/processors.

Thanks Shiny and Liquidity for your options and opinions, I appreciate it. I think you have pointed me in the exact direction that I wanted to be put in. I'll probably go the option of Alpine 9853/9855 at the moment, being cheaper and offering all I need and want and them being on special. If I find it lacking I may upgrade in the future to HX-D2 or F1 + processor, but I'll see how everything goes for the moment.

Thanks again for all your input.

Cheers,

Anthony

you can get a clarion hx-d2 for around that price point

4way x-over time alignement and eq

very solid headunit

external power supply

aren't they more round the 2k mark?