Ok guys on my day off I decded I'd go have a little play around with my car, and I did some mock-up wiring for my up and coming install. I whipped out the masking tape, the blue tac and cable ties and started thinking of where to mount my distro,fuse holders etc.

I also decided to do a bit of playing around with the ground side, to what i thought looked good and should be sufficient grounding(im doubling to trippling my power consumption) thanks to Marty @FHRX and his numerous install photos, inspiration struck and I decided to build a bus bar for the grounds. I'd like some opinions if, in ur expert opinions(which i value very much), the grounding I have "mocked up" will be sufficient.

Here are some pics:
Click to view attachmentClick to view attachmentClick to view attachment

Keep in mind that this is temporary so the dodgeyness will not be there when I do it properly. The bus bar will mount via a bolt to a sanded back section of the inner guard. The 2 blue 4g are extra grounds. 1 goes to the alternator and the other will bolt to the firewall as my amps are grounded to the floor...

The bit of aluminium is just a bit of scrap ill get a nicer piece and use correct sized bolts.

Here is a quick pic of the positive side:

Click to view attachment

see pic for notes.

thanks in advance Jono.

easier and neater to use a car audio battery terminal

example my grounds are 1/0 gauge directly to the RF negative battery post.




or if you can not afford to do that just copy the positive side of your setup. That ground bus bar is horrible and a waste of time. Why add more metal to your grounding than is needed???

What's wrong with a bus bar to distribute power?




It's exactly the same as a distro block, and can look neater as seen in picture

its up to personal taste

i dont like the bus bar setup

thats why i have a dual negative 1/0 guage battery terminal, plus can add another 4gague if need be, it just looks sooo much neater.

So how would you install a 5-point earthing kit?
Batt terminal -> Distro-block -> Earthing points?

it all depends on what grounding method you prefer

put it this way FHRX is a fan of the 5 point grounding system.

If I had the money I'd get a distro-block I must say but a neat bus-bar is effective and doesn't look all that bad IMHO

allright, so even if its not up to everyones tastes. is it effective? is aluminium a good enough conductor?

i liek ur setup stazed(and others Marty has done)

i also like urs too jas, but i dont want to spend 50-150 for a fancy battery term. well nto yet anyway.

keep the comments/pics coming!

stazed vs jas

jas upgraded all stock earthing points using 1/0 guage (only due to the extreme use of massive amps). all these are not centralised. 2 go from chassis to engine block, one from battery to chassis and the other from battery to engine block.

stazed upgraded all stock earthing points plus added extra and then connected them at a central point at the negative battery terminal. 5 wires all 4 gauge im assuming.

5 point eathing??? excuss the ignorance? but why would u need 5 aand where do they all go??

1 - chassis
2 - engine
3 - ?
4 - ?
5 - ?

just more points on the chassis?

from Jas' description he has four earthing points.
chassis x 3 + engine block.
However two of the chassis earths do not go directly to the battery but to the engine block first.

I have 5 earthing points. Four chassis + engine block.
You can see four of the cables here: http://camry.stazed.net/fhrx/apr2005/
The fifth is at the front of the car, just behind the headlights.

The same effect as Jas'. However I only had two factory earthing points, he appears to have had four

mmm.. bling.. im gonna do that

i never understood why you would want to improve the ground to the intake plenum.

I dont have anything that grounds to the plenum to start with - what good would it to do improve its connection to the battery ?

stazed - no ground from alternator ?

i have an old car(see sig) so there is very little electrics in my car, thus my choice of 2 earths (plus the bus bar earthing to front fender i.e. headlights)

i have earthed to firewall coz my ignition, all dash electrics, are earthed here indirectly or not. my amps will be groudned to the floor so this is as direct as i can get without running full length to amps. the other is to alt.

if u run EFI, grounding near ignition modules, coils, sensors, headlights etc, will or shud improve grounding, for better figures for ur computer to work with and also a stronger spark etc.

e.g. i had a poor ground to my fuel tank and thus my fuel level sender unit was giving a false reading never showing full. upon sanding back a few things and also adding a ground from chassis to the frame of sender it is acurate again and now reads full. now say this was for ur map or maf sensor. if these are giving slightly off readings it casues the computer to make the wrong air/fuel ratios or fiddle with timing etc...

I did one in my car, and I love it, looks awesome. For a few hours work, results are very good.


Very easy to do.



Dogo they recommend you ground to your plenum even with the HKS perfect circle kits too.

Static.

Air isnt always a neutral charge when its rubbing against a surface thats easily charged.

Also, some engines (hondas?) have completely different materials for the intake, the header, and the exhaust. I've seen cases of bad electrolysis, over years, corroding a whole block.

yer stazed? ground from alt???

so the general consensus is, no matter how u do it(bus bar, distro, straight from batt terminal) improving grounds is a good thing. and its nice to make it look bling! tegboy i love the silicone hoses! how much they set you back?

do u plan to just mount ur distro etc to the gaurd?

id make a nice mounting plate outa alluminium, that butts up against r battery, and against ur guard... (so one side would be rounded to fit gaurd and the other straight, to fit the battery)

then mount it, and mount ur distro to the plate, with some bling allen head screws or sumthin...

i like the bus bar, tho i know itd look more bling wen its done proply...

i got more ideas, tho im too tired, so ill write again 2mrw...

cheers...

I just thought, you could use a battery terminal quite easily, and just run a 0awg from a battery terminal to a busbar...but the effect of this is

Could you put the busbar ANYWHERE YOU WANTED (eg, in an enclosure, vented, directly underneath the battery holder.

This would make swapping batteries in/out a lot easier. you wouldnt need to refabricate things to fit a bigger battery, right?

Remember the earthing kits only work on cars with inadequate earths.

You'll find many more exotic cars such as Mercs, Porsches, BMWs, Rolls, Bentleys etc already have earths going everywhere so adding an earthing kit to them will get you nothing.

Very good point Marty.. but how many Rolls and Bentleys are being used on here The 5 point earthing kits are a good addition to most cars, and even if it doesn't help, it looks the biz!

the wiring in my engine bay originally consisted of 14awg from the alt, 4g to the starter and a single 6g ground from batt to alt. i needed to upgrade. thanks Marty for the inspiration...

Liquid, your point is valid, i do have a short length of 1/0g i could use to go from battery to a busbar/distro off the batt making upgrade(which i need to do later) and/or removal of batt easier.

these are the kinds of ideas/comments im after so i can do it once and do it right.

if u mount a 5 point bus bar to the car then wire from the battery to the busbar then the 5 earth points coming of the bar.. the mounitng pointing of the buss bar would be a 6th earth point.. correct? and its ok to do it this way?

No. Think of the busbar as just a long arm of the battery terminal.

In fact, you can think of all the wires as that as well. where these wires terminates, is a grounding point.

Technically the battery post IS "ground". Its not generally counted as a "point".



Yeah, i thought of that after a mobile battery service installed my optima (it was an emergency, so i just upgraded on the spot) and pretty much ripped my main ground cable out from it's hidden ends roots.

Lots of tension, and only enough ground to make sure the battery died bloody fast.
Apparently. Thats their version. I think they screwed the battery on installation.
Nearly made them replace my whole OEM harness to make sure there wasnt additional damage, but i'm not vindictive.

So i thought of making a easy option that would last me ages. Neater battery terminals too, that way.

Ahoy mateys Im a new guy to this forum.
I work for energy austrlalia as a electrical Mechanic and i understand the importance of Earthing/Ground why use a bus system if you dont need to? you create a large area to get heated up causing a rise in ohms (resistance) if you can i suggest direct contact with least joints.
in relation to the Question by prisoner about aluminium being a good conductor? its excellent for its price energy australia use it above ground on their power poles because its light cheap and a great conductor.

poisoner... i reckon use 0ga from batt term to a busbar sitting atop the gaurd... from there, distro to the other few grounding points using wotever guage u like... 4ga/2ga wotever...

this would look bling, sitting next to ur custom mounting plate for ur power distro block...

just a thort...

Welcome

Although the bus-bar is adding it's own resistance it's fairly negligble, as much resistance as running a length of cable instead I reckon

PRISONER!!! U FEIND! but thanks for the helpful info. i think i shal do as mad says. 1/0 to a bus bar. ill have to see if i have enough ring terminals! i want it to look bling ok? bling comes 1st grounding comes second!!!! KA CHING!!!

MAD!!! U FEIND!

LOL...

its mad89

read the name!...

yes yes... my suggestion is the best...

discussion over, close the thread...







PS: dont really close the thread...

LOL

just thought id revive this old thread as i have now completed the battery wiring. thought itd be cool to see the mock ups from b4 and now the finished version.

Click to view attachment

being that i have 2x 2g runs to the amps and only 1 4g ground to the floor pan of the car if this proves to be inadequate i will add a 1/0g run out the other end of the ground distro and run it to where one of the 4g currently is then adding the now redunant 4g to elsewhere say the intake manifold.

ENJOY!

Using a distro is nice and neat. Probably more expensive than a bus-bar, but then again its secure, and insulated. Might be the go

It's very "home hobby" friendly, innit

looks pretty cool too

hey liquid? """It's very "home hobby" friendly,""" what does that mean???

all of my distros, wires and connections i picked up 2nd hand or at a discounted price. it wouldnt be nearly as extravagant if i picked up some of the things retail price. im very happy with the final result(assuming i dont get any voltage drop or dimming or engine noise)

I mean it'd be easier for a home D.I.Y type person to use neat little distro's than figure out a way to create, mount, and insulate "proper" busbars.

ok thats cool, but why would u need to insulate a grounding bus bar? or when u say "proper" you mean if i had a positive bus bar

distros in my mind are pre made bus bars.. its still a big chunk of metal with versatile wiring options.

if you had two bus-bars (one positive, one negative) and something conductive fell across both of them (or from positive to chassis) you'd have one very, very big fire.

i thought that is what you meant. ive seen what can happen with heavy guage wire and a dead short .....

whether it be distros, bus bars or the battery it self, the utmost care should be taken to ensure nothing shorts.

cant be bothered typing it again...





- mad89

lol i was talking to a mate about how dangerous a short in a car can be...he didn't beleve me so i pulled out an old car battery and shorted about a 14 gauge length of wire and within secconds all the plastic jacketing had melted off and the wires was glowing white hot..i think if i didn't flip it off the wire itslelf would have melted.i think after that my friend went home and checked all of the electrics in his car

a mate tried to jump start his car using speaker wire once. The wire melted to the terminals and all the sleeving was dripping off

geez that was funny !

please tell us u got some photos... please?

- mad89

sorry, nope

I fried my very good multi meter becasue the leads were set up for 10A unfused current testing. and i was trying to measure voltage. oh whata sorry day that was. melted the DMM and the leads.

hey i brought one of them rockford fosgate battery terminals and just wondering how to hook up the postive factory wires to it with out looking crap. i was think as im only using one run of 0 gauge put another one in and put a disto block in hidden out of sight. but the problem is its only one i think its 8 gauge wire so its would be 0 to 8 which i dont think anyone makes

All "gauge" people should be shot, long live mm2

if your not going to be productive then go away.

i kno most of my mm^2 conversion. but AWG albeit american is the accepted norm.

i have 4g earth but 35mm^2 positive???

it's your first post and your having a go at alot of the longer standing members of this forum? GET OVER IT like the aviation business alot of it is based from over seas companies so you use their measurements not metric.

personally i wouldn't have a clue when it comes to mm^2 and metric is quickly becoming my second measurement now that i work on imperial aircraft.

Rhyso

Well said.....



On topic: Roo.........just get a 0g to 0g distro.

didnt want to start a new thread so ill post here.



Ive brought new battery terminals single input 0awg from terminal to distro (same as poisener usedfor his ground) now ive been told if i ran stereo cable to my alternator and fuse box it wont have enough current goin through it to start up the car is that correct. cause ive been looking at a few photos of all this and all of them are stereo type cable coming of the battery.

i dont quite understand can u explain a little better?



my 1/0g feeds my starter(stereos are never on with the starter nor are any accesories) my car lights and my stereo gear as u can see my alternator charge wire goes back to the distro which is pretty much the battery any way.



1/0g is capable of flowing about 300A its only required if u have some serious street gear in there. Volts(v) X current(a) = watts(w)



to keep it simple ill make all amps 50% efficient(most multi channel amps are around 50-60% and monos up to 80%



to use 300A... 13.8V (an average between 12 and 14.4) is over 4000W so call it 1500-2000wrms before you start going near it. in my car i have about 1200wrms on tap i think all up my stereo can use up to about 150A tho is closer to 100A



i could have run a single run of 2g from my batt for the amps and a single run of 2 or 4g for the starter and the rest of my wire sizes such as for my lights ignition etc would be 8g 12g or smaller



even if everything is running off the 1/0g wire like mine. u shouldn't run into problems.