This morning I read the thread on active networks and decided to reconfigure my fronts that way, and try and get serious about setting up my system as I am finally getting a decent sub.

I have a 10" Type S sub mounted in the left side of my boot. It is convenient and out of the way. I plan to mount the new Focal in a permanently fixed fibreglass enclosure (also, side mounted) but the box is going to be fine for the time being. The Pioneer HU's Autotune feature has always configured the sub with Phasing in Reverse, why? During listening kick bass is slower when the phase is set to normal, but the output is lower when set 180 degrees out of phase, even though it is faster.

I have 2 phase controls on my vehicle, one on the HU (Normal & Reverse) and one on the amp (180 degrees continuously adjustable). I just want to know what sort of procedure I can use to get this right. Do you theoretically work this out? ie it is 270 degrees out of phase at the moment relative to the rest of the system. So I would set the phase on the HU to reverse and the one on the amp to 90 (about halfway) and that would give me the 270 that I need?

This isn't very clear I think so ask questions...

Its perfectly clear, and its simply a matter of trial and error i'm afraid.

Every system will require different tuning, simply because your using a particular sub, in a particular exact location, in a particular car, and your asking it to blend with a particular type of front speakers, in a particular location, in a particular phase.

270 degrees out of phase, is exactly the same as 90 out of phase.

So, set the HU to something, leave it there, and start playing around with the amps setting. Adjust it, listen, adjust it, listen. As you say, different settings will offer different comprimises. Adjust it to suit you.

Last but not least, are you sure your front speakers are wired in phase? try swapping the +/- and the amp for only ONE side, and see if it has a positive or negative impact.

Cheers.

What he said:

Its perfectly clear, and its simply a matter of trial and error i'm afraid

Huh??
I dont think so... They are polar opposites. 270 deg out of phase is the same as NEGATIVE 90deg out of phase (-90). Simple Sine curve.

Acoustically, wouldnt that be the same thing while musics playing?

Acoustically? No. Could you hear the difference? I dont know. Maybe you could, maybe you couldnt.

Think of 0deg in phase being the speaker cone moved full inwards. Then 180deg out of phase would have the speaker cone moved full outwards for the same segment of sound. 90deg OOP would have the speaker cone at rest point moving towards fully outward, and 270deg OOP would have the speaker cone at rest point moving fully inwards.

If a kick-beat occurs when speaker is full outwards, then 90deg OOP would have that very beat delayed by the time it takes for the speaker to move 1/2 xmax, 180deg OOP would have the beat delayed by the time to move full-way xmax and 270deg OOP would have the beat delayed by the time it takes to move full-xmax plus 1/2 xmax. If that all can be understood....

I think 270 degrees is 180 degrees out of phase from 90 degrees. Cancelation? no?

Be stuffed if I know how you make a object that can only move 2 directions,
be 90 or 270 deg out of phase

Just try a few settings to see what sounds right,
I found I can get more output with inverse phase in my car, however the musicality of the sub is hopeless, be compared to in phase, so I put up with a little less output, to get the smoother response and more filled out bass response.

Don't be fooled into thinking that the kickyest loudest setting is correct.

listen to your bass as a whole, alot of different music in both in and out of phase,
to decide what is right. You bass should be seemless with your front stage, IE: be difficult to tell where the sub and mids start and stop. you shouldn't be able to instantly just hear your sub playing specifically around the crossover point.

Juls

Cheer's guys, its so hard with so much adjustability trying to get it to sound 'right.' I shall continue adjusting...